>.< Shedding!!!! Need some support ._.

This blows. I started doing the Oleda Baker scalp massages (twice daily) and Christopher Walken hair tugging (once daily) as well as ketoconazole once daily, and ugh the SHED

My hair looks so thin. I mean, obviously such vigorous massaging is bound to cause shedding, it just still sucks that's all ._.

I also am having trouble getting my hair to "tingle" after/during massages like people describe. It gets very warm (hell, I could SEE the vein near my right temple last night sticking out!)... but no tingle. I start on the Papilla Power technique soon.

Hm. I mean my hair still looks ok (bear in mind this is only thin relative to my hair which is quite naturally thick) but ugh it makes me feel like lame. I really hope these massages and shampoo works.

I'm so tempted to add in minoxidil (again), Folligen and/or topical nicotinic acid (flush niacin). Folligen is just so expensive and clumsy once you factor in the emu oil though (dunno if that stuff is essential).

Nicotinic acid seems like a wonder topical but maybe I'm missing something.

Damn I hope this is a good shed. Chances are I've pulled out all the telogen hairs with the massages. I just hope there are new hairs waiting to take their place

Hoppi

It happened to me 3 days into brushing. A couple of days later - regrowth. You need to get on the brush method to

hellwig wrote:It happened to me 3 days into brushing. A couple of days later - regrowth. You need to get on the brush method to

whoa serious? In DAYS??

So erm.. tell me more about the brush method? Do you get a scalp tingle?

And like, what do you think of the Chris Walken and Oleda Baker (and Papilla Power) approaches?

I'm very new to manual methods. I do think I can EVENTUALLY solve my hair loss internally but I've come to realize it's a slow process, and by the time I've had success internally at this rate I'll probably be bald!!

I need to fix my hair right away before it gets truly noticeable.. this is killing me seeing it look so junky

Everything about brushing is covered in the main thread

hellwig wrote:Everything about brushing is covered in the main thread

Awesome thank you very much, I think I'll read the whole thing!

I DO hope I get success soon! I would be so excited

how longs it been since u stopped minoxidil. how do u know its not a minoxidil shed.

also bear in mind the only hairs that should be coming out (if its not a minox shed) are hairs that were already destined to fall out.

Anxious1 wrote:how longs it been since u stopped minoxidil. how do u know its not a minoxidil shed.

also bear in mind the only hairs that should be coming out (if its not a minox shed) are hairs that were already destined to fall out.

Oh I stopped minox... ages ago, like last June. I didn't actually get much of a shed but then I wasn't really using it for long. It was Spectral UHP.

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

Looking forward to gettinga boar bristle brush though as I don't think my fingers are doing as much and a towel is very hard to use through long hair. A boar bristle brush with long, fairly spaced-out bristles is probably best for me!

[quote="hoppipolla"]

Anxious1 wrote:

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

the shed is from the niz shampoo!!! once daily is too much!
back when i was using niz (once every week) i shedded too, my hair got thin, i then dropped it.

[quote="gutted"]

hoppipolla wrote:

Anxious1 wrote:

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

the shed is from the niz shampoo!!! once daily is too much!
back when i was using niz (once every week) i shedded too, my hair got thin, i then dropped it.

hm, interesting theory. Although I am only using 1% Niz, maybe less. I basically take 2% Niz and dilute it half and half with water, so it's quite weak by the end.

I also have seen success stories with someone using 2% Niz daily and completely regrowing their hair...

2% does irritate my scalp too much though, which is why I diluted it

[quote="hoppipolla"]

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

Anxious1 wrote:

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

the shed is from the niz shampoo!!! once daily is too much!
back when i was using niz (once every week) i shedded too, my hair got thin, i then dropped it.

hm, interesting theory. Although I am only using 1% Niz, maybe less. I basically take 2% Niz and dilute it half and half with water, so it's quite weak by the end.

I also have seen success stories with someone using 2% Niz daily and completely regrowing their hair...

2% does irritate my scalp too much though, which is why I diluted it

the shed is without a doubt coming from the niz, but stick with it, and hopefully those hairs will return thicker.
Niz helps with the true cause of baldness.

[quote="gutted"]

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

Anxious1 wrote:

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

the shed is from the niz shampoo!!! once daily is too much!
back when i was using niz (once every week) i shedded too, my hair got thin, i then dropped it.

hm, interesting theory. Although I am only using 1% Niz, maybe less. I basically take 2% Niz and dilute it half and half with water, so it's quite weak by the end.

I also have seen success stories with someone using 2% Niz daily and completely regrowing their hair...

2% does irritate my scalp too much though, which is why I diluted it

the shed is without a doubt coming from the niz, but stick with it, and hopefully those hairs will return thicker.
Niz helps with the true cause of baldness.

well, you have to bear in mind I'm also very vigorously rubbing my scalp, which will be pulling out all the telogen hairs.

I can't wait to get my brushes! I should contact my bank to send the money to that German company

[quote="hoppipolla"]

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

Anxious1 wrote:

This shed is from all the vigorous scalp massaging I've been doing lol

the shed is from the niz shampoo!!! once daily is too much!
back when i was using niz (once every week) i shedded too, my hair got thin, i then dropped it.

hm, interesting theory. Although I am only using 1% Niz, maybe less. I basically take 2% Niz and dilute it half and half with water, so it's quite weak by the end.

I also have seen success stories with someone using 2% Niz daily and completely regrowing their hair...

2% does irritate my scalp too much though, which is why I diluted it

the shed is without a doubt coming from the niz, but stick with it, and hopefully those hairs will return thicker.
Niz helps with the true cause of baldness.

well, you have to bear in mind I'm also very vigorously rubbing my scalp, which will be pulling out all the telogen hairs.

I can't wait to get my brushes! I should contact my bank to send the money to that German company

its possible...but i think its coming from the niz
are you on any internal supps?

gutted wrote:its possible...but i think its coming from the niz
are you on any internal supps?

Erm, sort of. I am on a relatively strict diet that's loosely based on Ray Peat (very low starch, lots of coconuts and carrots, no grains, very few legumes, etc), I take glycine every day and lots of protein and nutrition, I take calendula and soon will be taking colostrum (instead).. erm... not much else. Milk thistle to help protect my liver from ketoconazole. That's about it

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:its possible...but i think its coming from the niz
are you on any internal supps?

Erm, sort of. I am on a relatively strict diet that's loosely based on Ray Peat (very low starch, lots of coconuts and carrots, no grains, very few legumes, etc), I take glycine every day and lots of protein and nutrition, I take calendula and soon will be taking colostrum (instead).. erm... not much else. Milk thistle to help protect my liver from ketoconazole. That's about it

hows your itch/sebum/dandruff?

i suppose niz would be taking care of that anyway.

But you need to stop infection! that is the true cause of baldness.

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:its possible...but i think its coming from the niz
are you on any internal supps?

Erm, sort of. I am on a relatively strict diet that's loosely based on Ray Peat (very low starch, lots of coconuts and carrots, no grains, very few legumes, etc), I take glycine every day and lots of protein and nutrition, I take calendula and soon will be taking colostrum (instead).. erm... not much else. Milk thistle to help protect my liver from ketoconazole. That's about it

hows your itch/sebum/dandruff?

i suppose niz would be taking care of that anyway.

But you need to stop infection! that is the true cause of baldness.

99% gone

And erm... yeah it might be.. however when I was applying tea tree / thyme to my head 3 times a day I had no dandruff or itching and was still losing a ton of hair. But maybe I didn't keep it up long enough, I dunno.

I always thought it went androgens -> sebum -> infection -> inflammation -> destroyed blood vessels -> hair loss

But I'm not sure o.O

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:its possible...but i think its coming from the niz
are you on any internal supps?

Erm, sort of. I am on a relatively strict diet that's loosely based on Ray Peat (very low starch, lots of coconuts and carrots, no grains, very few legumes, etc), I take glycine every day and lots of protein and nutrition, I take calendula and soon will be taking colostrum (instead).. erm... not much else. Milk thistle to help protect my liver from ketoconazole. That's about it

hows your itch/sebum/dandruff?

i suppose niz would be taking care of that anyway.

But you need to stop infection! that is the true cause of baldness.

99% gone

And erm... yeah it might be.. however when I was applying tea tree / thyme to my head 3 times a day I had no dandruff or itching and was still losing a ton of hair. But maybe I didn't keep it up long enough, I dunno.

I always thought it went androgens -> sebum -> infection -> inflammation -> destroyed blood vessels -> hair loss

But I'm not sure o.O

androgens -> sebum -> infection -> inflammation -> destroyed blood vessels -> hair loss!!!!

true cause of baldness!

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:99% gone

And erm... yeah it might be.. however when I was applying tea tree / thyme to my head 3 times a day I had no dandruff or itching and was still losing a ton of hair. But maybe I didn't keep it up long enough, I dunno.

I always thought it went androgens -> sebum -> infection -> inflammation -> destroyed blood vessels -> hair loss

But I'm not sure o.O

androgens -> sebum -> infection -> inflammation -> destroyed blood vessels -> hair loss!!!!

true cause of baldness!

haha mega awesome that our theories match up so closely!

I do hope we're right, but I'm not sure

im 1000% sure!
take some natrual antibiotics...and you'll be fine

gutted wrote:im 1000% sure!
take some natrual antibiotics...and you'll be fine

Sooooo well... here's the big question... how is your hair loss doing?

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:im 1000% sure!
take some natrual antibiotics...and you'll be fine

Sooooo well... here's the big question... how is your hair loss doing?

its doing really good! im hoping to achieve some hairline and temporal regrowth in the coming months.

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:im 1000% sure!
take some natrual antibiotics...and you'll be fine

Sooooo well... here's the big question... how is your hair loss doing?

its doing really good! im hoping to achieve some hairline and temporal regrowth in the coming months.

Has your shedding stopped though?

I have experimented with antibacterials and all-sorts, but my problem is sticking to something. I always find it hard to persevere with something if I don't have complete confidence it will work. I have a lot of confidence in Niz and manual methods like brushing, so I'm giving them my all a bit more. Plus they do feel kinda good, and I never liked the way most topicals made my hair smell or look bad. After manual methods although my long hair is a bit messy, my hair does LOOK really good overall, and seems to have more life and stuff.

So yeah, they're quite pleasing to do particularly as you get better at them!

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:im 1000% sure!
take some natrual antibiotics...and you'll be fine

Sooooo well... here's the big question... how is your hair loss doing?

its doing really good! im hoping to achieve some hairline and temporal regrowth in the coming months.

Has your shedding stopped though?

I have experimented with antibacterials and all-sorts, but my problem is sticking to something. I always find it hard to persevere with something if I don't have complete confidence it will work. I have a lot of confidence in Niz and manual methods like brushing, so I'm giving them my all a bit more. Plus they do feel kinda good, and I never liked the way most topicals made my hair smell or look bad. After manual methods although my long hair is a bit messy, my hair does LOOK really good overall, and seems to have more life and stuff.

So yeah, they're quite pleasing to do particularly as you get better at them!

my shed has stoppped...and have got regrowth too.

im on a few things though, but once you know the true cause of baldness you can stop your loss...but if you want regrowth you will need some stimulation...improving scalp circulation is good after ingesting some growth stimulants.
and the key thing is being consistent with whatever you are on...only until youve allowed the hair follicle to regenerate, once its regenerated you an stop and do maintenance sessions!

gutted wrote:my shed has stoppped...and have got regrowth too.

im on a few things though, but once you know the true cause of baldness you can stop your loss...but if you want regrowth you will need some stimulation...improving scalp circulation is good after ingesting some growth stimulants.
and the key thing is being consistent with whatever you are on...only until youve allowed the hair follicle to regenerate, once its regenerated you an stop and do maintenance sessions!

Wow that's awesome mate! Sounds like you came into it with a bit more confidence and focus than me and it paid off!!

So what is your regimen? It's really cool to hear from someone who had success with an approach I tried too!

hoppipolla wrote:

gutted wrote:my shed has stoppped...and have got regrowth too.

im on a few things though, but once you know the true cause of baldness you can stop your loss...but if you want regrowth you will need some stimulation...improving scalp circulation is good after ingesting some growth stimulants.
and the key thing is being consistent with whatever you are on...only until youve allowed the hair follicle to regenerate, once its regenerated you an stop and do maintenance sessions!

Wow that's awesome mate! Sounds like you came into it with a bit more confidence and focus than me and it paid off!!

So what is your regimen? It's really cool to hear from someone who had success with an approach I tried too!

my regimen is msm/trx2
Scalp massages after ingesting these.
im hoping to add some garlic in there soon.
A diet without any dairy/or limited dairy.

the thing is with any regimen you need to be really consistent, if your not, your not going to see results.
I truley believe mpb is a result of pathogenic friendly bacteria that the body has under control but due to excess/unfiltered dht the bacteria grow out of control.

gutted wrote:my regimen is msm/trx2
Scalp massages after ingesting these.
im hoping to add some garlic in there soon.
A diet without any dairy/or limited dairy.

the thing is with any regimen you need to be really consistent, if your not, your not going to see results.
I truley believe mpb is a result of pathogenic friendly bacteria that the body has under control but due to excess/unfiltered dht the bacteria grow out of control.

You may well be right

Is MSM your antibacterial then?

And why do you rule out dairy? I have completely stopped eating grains and starch pretty much (helps my digestion no end) and legumes 95%, but I still eat a lot of dairy, mostly greek yogurt. What do you perceive as being wrong with dairy?


And yeah persevering with something is my biggest problem. I can keep up capsules, but sometimes if I don't see results quickly, I get discouraged and stop, which is bad I know. I'm getting better as I get more confident in my choices though!