Immortal's DMSO/Lithium Topical

I know there's information sprinkled throughout the forum about this but it'd be nice to have one definitive thread. I sit here with all the necessary ingredients, a little timid to start (after hearing some horror stories) but I'm ready to give it a try.

- 8oz bottle of Aubrey Organics Ginseng Biotin Shampoo
- 99% DMSO - 1.0 tsp
- Lithium Orotate Power - 1.5-2.0 tsp

Any suggestions on mixing the solution? The warning on the DMSO is unsettling, making me think it might melt whatever container I put this stuff in. Will simply stirring it about suffice?

Concerning the sensitive skin, when you say use a 50 to 70% solution of DMSO, do you mean just use 50 to 70% of a single tsp?

Is it safe to use hydrocortisone after rinsing my scalp with this at night (I'm under the impression DMSO pulls things deeper into the tissue with it)?

Many thanks and appreciate all the information here already!

zeus - Let me reassure you about the DMSO. I have worked at a clinic where patients in the thousands have used DMSO topically (usually on there arthritic areas) and at 70% delivered by a cream.

The FDA has for questionable reasons deems it a solvent, so despite the therapeutic uses, which are many, we were not able to make any medical claims whatsoever. To quote one of the pioneers who brought this into use on a mass scale has said regarding DMSO and the FDA's requirement that it be labeled as a solvent, "That's just FDA nonsense."

Mixing two tsps (you can use one, but I prefer two) into an 8 oz. bottle of shampoo is extremely diluted significantly well 70% DMSO. There's nothing to fear but fear itself--at least the DMSO.

Lithium is probably the question. To many including myself there is nothing negative. However, for reasons totally unknown to me, according to studies, while Lithium works well for certain disorders, some apparently get an irritation from it.

I've used it know for a while without any hint of incident, so see how it goes.

I put "warnings" about sensitive skin about DMSO on the site, but only did so just in case. I think if anything, it's the Lithium.

It's easiest to pour out half the bottle of shampoo into another container (to be later be added back), toss the lithium powder and DMSO in there, put the cap on and shake. You'll likely notice a little heat being generated (that's the lithium).

Add back some of the remaining shampoo until it's almost full, the rest you can add later as needed.

Thanks Caustic-- any suggestion on how long to leave it on? I figured since it's a rinse I just massage it in and wash it right out. You've probably answered this a hundred times, just wanted to confirm.

So far using it tonight and this morning I can say for sure, my hair hasn't felt this clean in over a year and a half since I noticed my hair loss. Cheers.

Personally, I let it stay on for a few minutes to give it some absorption time.

Hi Zeus, great post, Im in exactly in the same boat as you. Ive even had everything mixed up by early July but havent dared touch it yet even though i strongly feel that this would help me out a lot with my seborrheic dermatitis/sebum production and itch. By all means give continous feedback on your progress.

IH, do dermatologists use topical lithium for seborrheic dermatitis as a normal treatment, or is the study thats given in the topical site only a early research that hasnt been followed up on?

if its the lithium thats causing the problem, would the shampoo with solely DMSO be of any use to rinse of the scalp?

And zeus, regarding its application on the scalp, im pretty sure IH will tell you to be rather delicate while applying it and let it stay in there for 30 seconds before you rinse, no need to massage or rub it in, the DMSO will do the job itself. Ive also the impression that this is a once-a-day thing.

Epdaman--

Just use it, no worries. Derms don't know jack-crap compared to where we are in the realm of natural and cutting-edge treatments. I'd do twice a day for months and it worked well for me.

Most Dermatologists would recommend ketoconazole. Lithium is not used by conventional doctors that often.

Lithium is quite safe, I think if there's any concern it will be apparent quickly but without anything noteworthy.

Lithium is practically an essential mineral.

I use the stuff just like any other shampoo, but I have peace of mind when I use it, because the shampoo that I use is totally natural, so there's no guilt using something that's going to hurt the hair. Also I suppose you could gently massage it in for 30 seconds or a couple of minutes, but either way it'll work.

I have very oily, fine hair, and have always had to wash my hair twice during every shower. I use my regular shampoo first and then use the aubreys mens stock with the lithium and dmso. Never in my 50 years have I been able to go all day and have my hair feel so clean for so long. I highly reccomend it. I also take lithium orally in the am and evening. It really helps reduce sebum on my scalp. What was the reasoning for taking caffeine out, I probably missed the answer, but someone please indulge me. Thanks.

fadero - The short answer is, the caffeine did not seem to work, it also raised the risk of getting a headache, so I removed it.

Been on ketoconazole a couple of years ago, didnt help and made me flake terribly. Have a small problem though, my GF almost finished medschool, so you can imagine she's skeptical to this type of "unproven treatments". She's actually getting me to see a dermatologist again, and i will to ask about the lithium study this time. I guess this is the problem with the whole current conventional medical establishment, its like Thomas Kuhn predicted; any researchers with established theories will always work against a paradigmatic shift. Add that to the typical doctor-patient information asymmetry and you've got the recipe for a very awkward session. Hehe

epdaman - I got a general formula and it goes something like this:

95% of physicians are going to follow the AMA and FDA approved procedures, it keeps them out of hot water.

The conventional viewpoint is safe from a professional standpoint (think career stability).

Among 5% of physicians are highly innovative and eventually break strides from the heard. Usually it's the doctor who is informed outside of medical school who becomes of these, because medical school is nothing short of indoctrination.

Here's what is usually heard when an exchange of questions regarding unconventional treatments occur between doctor and patient.

"There's no research" (Most of the time, there is research, they just haven't looked at it).

"It's not FDA approved" (It's natural so there's no financial incentive to pay the FDA the required fees to obtain approval).

"I don't know" (an honest doctor)

Fantastic explanation there IH!

So I've been using this for about 10 days now. Most of my itch is gone though when I run my hands over my scalp a bunch of flakes come out (along with a decent amount of hair), scalp redness has stayed the same. I'm noticing that I'm breaking out with some pimples on my face, which is unusual since that hasn't been an issue for me ever. Could that be my body reacting to the topical and pushing some toxins out?

Will continue to ride things out.

just put all the ingredients together and had a question for you IH:

i have a 14 oz bottle of shampoo i'm using this with, so i used approx 4 or 4 and a half teaspoons of powdered lithium orotate pills (the ones from iherb, advanced research) and 2 teaspoons of 99.9% dmso. i followed ur technique of emptying half the bottle out and then mixing in the ingredients and then adding back the rest of the shampoo. As I see it now, the shampoo has suspended white particles of the white lithium powder throughout.
my question is, given the above quantities I used, is this normal or is the lithium supposed to blend right into the shampoo?
also with the quantities I used, is the shampoo now too concentrated or is it still safe to use on a daily basis?

thanks, your help is much appreciated!

zeus - I haven't heard of any reports of acne with Lithium. But it may be a reaction to something else. It's good to ride things out and see what happens. Very often, an acne effect could be a short term effect of some internals.

I've also been using the topical for 2 weeks now. Itching has gone down a bit. Shedding has gone down a bit as well. Though i am still losing several hairs per shampoo. No side affects btw. I feel like it's not strong enough though.

It's strange but it seems like i'm itching at night when i'm home. Maybe during the day, i don't think about it? Or the effect of the topical wears off at night?

Demodex mites come out at night! I suggested it just now in another thread, but you can try a 50% Tea Tree Oil/50% Lavender Oil mix to apply topically before bed. Works great against fungus and demodex.

any update zeus ? and of course other guys on the DMSO/Lithium ( hadrion, nid, the ones on this thread , etc..)? Thanx

europe -

I guess my update is the topical helps in keeping inflammation & itching under control with daily use which is great. I think it slows down the progression of loss.

I don't think it stopped the loss for me as I think I've lost ground in the past months.

As to whether it leads to regrowth, it has not for me.

zeus wrote:So I've been using this for about 10 days now. Most of my itch is gone though when I run my hands over my scalp a bunch of flakes come out (along with a decent amount of hair), scalp redness has stayed the same. I'm noticing that I'm breaking out with some pimples on my face, which is unusual since that hasn't been an issue for me ever. Could that be my body reacting to the topical and pushing some toxins out?

Will continue to ride things out.

I wonder if it isn't the Biotin that could be causing the acne?

From another board:


I used to megadose B5 to control my acne and oily skin. I was on it off and on for around 4 years and found it to be very good, so good in fact that I'd go as far as to call it a cure as it completely stopped my sebum production on my skin.

Two side effects occured though, an increase in sensitivity to heat and therefore sweating and hair loss. I tried combatting these by adding a B complex but to my horrow my oily skin and acne returned whenever I started taking a B complex! I quickly dropped the B complex and my skin gradually returned to normal, so I started looked for an alternative.

I thought I'd try dosing the B vitamins individually with the B5 to see which one caused the oily skin to return. I started with Biotin as it's been said to help hair loss. A few days after taking Biotin my oily skin and acne returned once more!

In the end I just continued megadosing B5 until a hot summer took it's toll on my temperature sensitivity and sweating and I stopped taking B5 altogether.

When my acne returned I tried experimenting with Soy, Green Tea, etc but with little success so I've finally turned to Accutane to try and control my oily skin and acne. It's only been a few days but hopefully it will work as well as the B5 did without the same side effects.

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So based upon the above information, my theory ... Generally it's not really understood exactly how Accutane stops oil production, and likewise how B5 does the same. There was the initial study done by Dr. Leung on B5 but there's been nothing since, and even with Accutane there isn't really anything conclusive as to how it works.

What I am interested in is that I've researched that B5 can result in Biotin uptake from the intestines being blocked, so basically you'll become deficient in Biotin when megadosing B5. I was also interested to read that, while Accutane does not lower Biotin levels, it inhibits the body's ability to use Biotin.

www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/natural/patient-biotin.html

"Pantothenic acid: High-doses of pantothenic acid can lead to malabsorption of biotin in the gut, and can lower levels of biotin in the body."

"Isotretinoin (Accutane): May reduce biotinidase activity. It is not clear if biotin supplementation may be warranted during chronic use."

It is therefore my theory that both B5 and Accutane reduce sebum production due to their lowering or inhibition of Biotin in the body. This theory is in part backed up with my experience where when taking B5 and I added Biotin supplements to my regime my oily skin and acne returned.

I admittedly haven't read anything in this thread. I just wanted to put in my 2 cents about using DMSO in the past. I could never do it again because I already have this paranoia about my breath smelling and I know for a fact due to comments like, "Holy shit that is god awful!" That DMSO will absorb systemically and cause you to have what makes garlic breath seem like a mouth full of Altoids. That's my hang up on breath!...No one is going to tell you if it stinks! Even friends or loved ones don't want to hurt your feelings and/or smell you breath in their face! Are there no honest people left!?

JHarsh80 - If you were to use this as a topical that isn't rinsed off or worse, if you took it as an IV, which is used for Interstitial Cystitis then smelling god awful be expected.

But in the case of the topical, you're mixing a few grams into an 8 oz container and then rinsing the contents. There's no smell whatsoever.

On a side note, I'm still using topical potassium chloride instead of the Lithium/DMSO combo....so far so good.

I've been using the topical for over a year. I haven't had any complaints about breath. Believe me, my wife would let me know.