Detumescence Therapy- dedicated volunteers wanted

rofl wrote:no doubt the extra amount of skin contact with dirty hands has played a role in spreading it.

think this is a solid point, if doing DT; of utmost importance to keep the scalp super clean else your potentially just spreading muck all across your scalp ... and I imagine DT oxidises a lot of the muck too ... so some sort of scalp cleaning regime before and/or after makes sense, to my mind at least.

Columbo wrote:

rofl wrote:no doubt the extra amount of skin contact with dirty hands has played a role in spreading it.

think this is a solid point, if doing DT; of utmost importance to keep the scalp super clean else your potentially just spreading muck all across your scalp ... and I imagine DT oxidises a lot of the muck too ... so some sort of scalp cleaning regime before and/or after makes sense, to my mind at least.

Yes that's definitely not it, I wash my hands before I do anything many times per day, shower every day (because I'm doing Sage's topical so I don't really have a choice), and spray my scalp with rosemary tea/ACV throughout the day.

it doesnt matter. i am uber clean and use constant alternating chemical anti fungals and anti bacterials, and i still get it. i said dirty hands may be contributing, but even if they're not, malezzia furfur lives on our skin, a certain percentage are susceptible to overgrowth. there seems to be no rhyme or reason to it, but perhaps its something in our diets that comes out in our sweat.

my point is, if you dont have dirty hands, then great, i take back what i said, but it still doesnt mean you dont have sebborraic dermititis. remembering that the causal fungi lives on our skin, clean hands can still spread it around. each time you touch your skin, your hands are then contaminated. no matter how much u sanitise your hands they will always carry normal flora (bacteria and fungi)

alot of conditions are caused by normal flora that simply gets overgrown for one reason or another. when IDing bacteria and fungi in the lab, you have to grow the organisms from the specimen, and determine whats normal flora, and whats overgrowth. you use different amount of contaminating strokes on a agar plate (a 16 streak test) and see how far the organism gets.

simple solution: don't use your hands, use a device. what device, I'm not sure. but i bet with a bit of ingenuity there's something that could be cobbled together.

Anyone else with closely buzzed hair notice wrinkled/stretch mark scalp from DT? I would imagine that would be a rather big deterrent . I want to start up again soon, but a scalp covered with stretch marks is rather disconcerting...

Maybe they are there during the first month but go away as the scalp becomes more relaxed??

I'll let you know soon, Sizzling. I've just quit my job and will be breaking contact with everyone there to start a new life as a balding man, versus the long messy mophead I had going on in attempts to conceal. So, going for a short clean cut and I'll finally see how things look.

Also, I plan on restarting DT so I will post occasional updates in this thread as need be. I stopped due to believing I'd be getting a transplant soon, and wanted to see if my hair could hold up without the massages. Anyway, HT doc told me he doesn't want to do anything to ruin my life in the future and that I'm too young, wait a year, etc. so, here I am.

SonofOdin wrote:I'll let you know soon, Sizzling. I've just quit my job and will be breaking contact with everyone there to start a new life as a balding man, versus the long messy mophead I had going on in attempts to conceal. So, going for a short clean cut and I'll finally see how things look.

Also, I plan on restarting DT so I will post occasional updates in this thread as need be. I stopped due to believing I'd be getting a transplant soon, and wanted to see if my hair could hold up without the massages. Anyway, HT doc told me he doesn't want to do anything to ruin my life in the future and that I'm too young, wait a year, etc. so, here I am.

Hi Odin

Did you by any chance mention DT to him, or at least discuss some sort of scalp laxity exercises?

Maybe you could use some sort of antiseptic oil when doing DT to kill any bacteria on the spot? Tea-tree oil comes to mind for me.

Odin, good luck on your fresh start to life. Hopefully you like the look of your head when it's shaved.

australian wrote:Maybe you could use some sort of antiseptic oil when doing DT to kill any bacteria on the spot? Tea-tree oil comes to mind for me.

Odin, good luck on your fresh start to life. Hopefully you like the look of your head when it's shaved.

I actually would like to do that, but I would think that since it makes everything slippery, wouldn't your fingers slide over your scalp and pull/break hairs? Without the oil is much easier I think, you just plant your fingers and press hard and they don't move.

John, if the weather permits, the HT doc will be flying down to my area to visit with me, and a few other patients in person and so I'll mention it to him then. I did a skype consult and in addition to the fact I'm really young, he was having difficulties seeing the density of my hair. It seemed important to him whether my hair follicles themselves were thick vs. fine. I have read that scalp elasticity is important for transplants and that you want an elastic scalp so, perhaps all my months of massage will help me get the biggest bang for my buck if I go through with a procedure.

sizzlinghairs wrote:Anyone else with closely buzzed hair notice wrinkled/stretch mark scalp from DT? I would imagine that would be a rather big deterrent . I want to start up again soon, but a scalp covered with stretch marks is rather disconcerting...

Maybe they are there during the first month but go away as the scalp becomes more relaxed??

Yes. Very noticeable. I have been asked why I have such distinct wrinkles on my scalp. It certainly is a deterrent.

Ack, doesn't sound encouraging I was thinking of buzzing before I start DT again but maybe I shouldn't..


Well.. Is there anyone who's been doing DT for awhile and *not getting* a wrinkled scalp? Sounds rather unpleasant to look at....

SonofOdin wrote:John, if the weather permits, the HT doc will be flying down to my area to visit with me, and a few other patients in person and so I'll mention it to him then. I did a skype consult and in addition to the fact I'm really young, he was having difficulties seeing the density of my hair. It seemed important to him whether my hair follicles themselves were thick vs. fine. I have read that scalp elasticity is important for transplants and that you want an elastic scalp so, perhaps all my months of massage will help me get the biggest bang for my buck if I go through with a procedure.

Great, and DT certainly helps with elasticity so that's good

I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Stop now and get into different areas of the forum. Look into diets and proper supplements.

Yes. Very noticeable. I have been asked why I have such distinct wrinkles on my scalp. It certainly is a deterrent.

Would you by any chance have a picture of them?

RAptor wrote:

Yes. Very noticeable. I have been asked why I have such distinct wrinkles on my scalp. It certainly is a deterrent.

Would you by any chance have a picture of them?

No. Since first losing my hair I have always disliked being photographed. I have very few photo's saved of myself in the last 20 years. I reduced the intensity of doing DT considerably after being asked why I had such deep lines on my scalp. These were 3 lines as distinct as 3 cat scrawls from front to back of the scalp. After a period of time of not practicing DT regularly they faded. They did look bad. I couldn't see them from the front, but were very noticeable to others on the top of my head and were a source of amusement to some!)
I suppose if I was more careful at the beginning of squeezing the scalp in different directions it may have avoided this issue, even though I did imagine I was alternating the directions of folding the scalp. After noticing the wrinkles I was more conscious of squeezing the scalp in other directions so any wrinkles would be at an angle to the others but it didn't help. I tried squeezing smaller folds between these 3 lines/wrinkles but I was getting the same result of deepening the same 3 wrinkles.
Squeezing the scalp and making circles with your fingers might help avoid the same issue occuring to others. It was enough to dampen my motivation to continue with it intensly.
There certainly is a relieving sensation in the scalp from DT. It does feel good. Whether it actually regrows hair is another matter.

thisainteasy wrote:I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Nope, that's not the problem, DT is the problem. It causes worse baldness because mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull; this is why your hair is thinning worse than ever.  Look up 'pressure alopecia' or 'pressure ulcer' to find out why DT is causing these problems.

This whole thing is a hoax.

ETA: you're correct about your scalp becoming thinner - the repeated mechanical force is destroying underlying layers of the skin. The person/s responsible for this hoax need to be shot.

Xenon wrote:

thisainteasy wrote:I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Nope, that's not the problem, DT is the problem. It causes worse baldness because mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull; this is why your hair is thinning worse than ever.  Look up 'pressure alopecia' or 'pressure ulcer' to find out why DT is causing these problems.

This whole thing is a hoax.

Not true. this part : "mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull" isnt true coz your not to press against the skull - this way it even causes pain so why do it this way ? DT is about bringing circulation for the blood and lymph - thats why the skin is "more elastic" , there is just more blood there.

@ thisainteasy, lol your login... it wont be an easy year for you my friend. you are overdoing it. so did i in the beginning. try to lower the time/ intensity. lets say 3 times lower for the beginning. if you did it everyday,try every 3rd day for 2-3 months now. recovery is the key and it takes time. im in 14 months and the regrowth started like 2 ? months ago ... which means i was losing hair everyday for the first 6months circa. i lost like 30-40 % hair i guess. was terified now and then to be honest. now its much better. i dont even think about the hair that much coz i know im getting the hair back everyday more. next summer i will have a solid regrowth. i have NEVER (since im watching my hair so like last 5 years) seen so many vellus hair ( or whatever you call it - those white/blond hair) and the lenght of those is kinda nice yea, they are getting terminal . no, im not imaging or whatever. and no i dont care for no pictures i have photophobia. i will upload pictures in year only for motivation. coz thats what im doing right now. all i want is for the dude to not worry as much as i did. DONT WORRY ITS GONNA BE ALIGHT

Florain wrote:

Xenon wrote:

thisainteasy wrote:I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Nope, that's not the problem, DT is the problem. It causes worse baldness because mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull; this is why your hair is thinning worse than ever.  Look up 'pressure alopecia' or 'pressure ulcer' to find out why DT is causing these problems.

This whole thing is a hoax.

Not true. this part : "mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull" isnt true coz your not to press against the skull - this way it even causes pain so why do it this way ? DT is about bringing circulation for the blood and lymph - thats why the skin is "more elastic" , there is just more blood there.

@ thisainteasy, lol your login... it wont be an easy year for you my friend. you are overdoing it. so did i in the beginning. try to lower the time/ intensity. lets say 3 times lower for the beginning. if you did it everyday,try every 3rd day for 2-3 months now. recovery is the key and it takes time. im in 14 months and the regrowth started like 2 ? months ago ... which means i was losing hair everyday for the first 6months circa. i lost like 30-40 % hair i guess. was terified now and then to be honest. now its much better. i dont even think about the hair that much coz i know im getting the hair back everyday more. next summer i will have a solid regrowth. i have NEVER (since im watching my hair so like last 5 years) seen so many vellus hair ( or whatever you call it - those white/blond hair) and the lenght of those is kinda nice yea, they are getting terminal . no, im not imaging or whatever. and no i dont care for no pictures i have photophobia. i will upload pictures in year only for motivation. coz thats what im doing right now. all i want is for the dude to not worry as much as i did. DONT WORRY ITS GONNA BE ALIGHT

Hey Florain

I was wondering, as part of my DT session, I do a kind of deep scalp massage, plant both hands and try to massage pretty deep in circular motions.  After that I do the "pinching", but I mostly use two hands to pinch some scalp and press down since it's not really elastic enough to only use one hand and my nails.

Is this more or less what you do? I'm not that worried since deep scalp massage is a thing and not only related to DT.

Thanks

johndoe1225 wrote:

Florain wrote:

Xenon wrote:

thisainteasy wrote:I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Nope, that's not the problem, DT is the problem. It causes worse baldness because mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull; this is why your hair is thinning worse than ever.  Look up 'pressure alopecia' or 'pressure ulcer' to find out why DT is causing these problems.

This whole thing is a hoax.

Not true. this part : "mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull" isnt true coz your not to press against the skull - this way it even causes pain so why do it this way ? DT is about bringing circulation for the blood and lymph - thats why the skin is "more elastic" , there is just more blood there.

@ thisainteasy, lol your login... it wont be an easy year for you my friend. you are overdoing it. so did i in the beginning. try to lower the time/ intensity. lets say 3 times lower for the beginning. if you did it everyday,try every 3rd day for 2-3 months now. recovery is the key and it takes time. im in 14 months and the regrowth started like 2 ? months ago ... which means i was losing hair everyday for the first 6months circa. i lost like 30-40 % hair i guess. was terified now and then to be honest. now its much better. i dont even think about the hair that much coz i know im getting the hair back everyday more. next summer i will have a solid regrowth. i have NEVER (since im watching my hair so like last 5 years) seen so many vellus hair ( or whatever you call it - those white/blond hair) and the lenght of those is kinda nice yea, they are getting terminal . no, im not imaging or whatever. and no i dont care for no pictures i have photophobia. i will upload pictures in year only for motivation. coz thats what im doing right now. all i want is for the dude to not worry as much as i did. DONT WORRY ITS GONNA BE ALIGHT

Hey Florain

I was wondering, as part of my DT session, I do a kind of deep scalp massage, plant both hands and try to massage pretty deep in circular motions.  After that I do the "pinching", but I mostly use two hands to pinch some scalp and press down since it's not really elastic enough to only use one hand and my nails.

Is this more or less what you do?  I'm not that worried since deep scalp massage is a thing and not only related to DT.

Thanks

yea thats it. you have to do it really gently most of the time, especially first few minutes of each session. i start by massaging the parts that have most hair and then work my way up till "the ridge" is guess ( the most top part of the skull). ayurvedic(?) massaging and the end - its just tapping fast but gently the skin ( for lymph or whatever). you have to concentrate on the feeling when you are massaging is guess. i hope it helps


EDIT - ayurvedic "at" the end not and

EDIT 2 - oh and by the way... "concentrate on the feeling " is hard at the beginning coz there is almost no blood there thats where it becomes tricky haha. you have no feeling and your not even concious that you are causing yourself pain coz you dont feel the pain yet. thats why i was overdoing it at the beginning. fuck it tho its over now

Florain wrote:

johndoe1225 wrote:

Florain wrote:

Xenon wrote:

thisainteasy wrote:I'm 3 months in on DT now, and my hair gets thinner and worse. It gets so thin that I can see the back of my scalp from the front (diffuse thinning) and I see lots of thin patches all over my scalp, especially around areas where my fingers mostly reside during DT session. My hair was already thin before DT but it wasn't as bad as it is now. Not even close. My front forehead is so thin now all over. I can even see thinning, almost-bald spot on the back of my scalp. Didn't see this before DT.

Sure, the scalp is now much more elastic and flattened, and I can even feel the ridge of my scalp now as I'm kneading and pinching my scalp all over. But the hair keeps thinning and shedding. This is really discouraging.

This sucks. I had high hopes that this method will help reverse my hair loss, especially after hearing positive testimonials all around forum. The problem is that nobody tells us the right way of doing DT in comprehensive, straight-to-the-point ways. I have a gut feeling I've been doing it all wrong, unless if this massive thinning is part of the process.

What have I done wrong in DT? What's the right way of doing it.

Nope, that's not the problem, DT is the problem. It causes worse baldness because mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull; this is why your hair is thinning worse than ever.  Look up 'pressure alopecia' or 'pressure ulcer' to find out why DT is causing these problems.

This whole thing is a hoax.

Not true. this part : "mechanical force is crushing your follicles against the hard mass of your skull" isnt true coz your not to press against the skull - this way it even causes pain so why do it this way ? DT is about bringing circulation for the blood and lymph - thats why the skin is "more elastic" , there is just more blood there.

@ thisainteasy, lol your login... it wont be an easy year for you my friend. you are overdoing it. so did i in the beginning. try to lower the time/ intensity. lets say 3 times lower for the beginning. if you did it everyday,try every 3rd day for 2-3 months now. recovery is the key and it takes time. im in 14 months and the regrowth started like 2 ? months ago ... which means i was losing hair everyday for the first 6months circa. i lost like 30-40 % hair i guess. was terified now and then to be honest. now its much better. i dont even think about the hair that much coz i know im getting the hair back everyday more. next summer i will have a solid regrowth. i have NEVER (since im watching my hair so like last 5 years) seen so many vellus hair ( or whatever you call it - those white/blond hair) and the lenght of those is kinda nice yea, they are getting terminal . no, im not imaging or whatever. and no i dont care for no pictures i have photophobia. i will upload pictures in year only for motivation. coz thats what im doing right now. all i want is for the dude to not worry as much as i did. DONT WORRY ITS GONNA BE ALIGHT

Hey Florain

I was wondering, as part of my DT session, I do a kind of deep scalp massage, plant both hands and try to massage pretty deep in circular motions.  After that I do the "pinching", but I mostly use two hands to pinch some scalp and press down since it's not really elastic enough to only use one hand and my nails.

Is this more or less what you do?  I'm not that worried since deep scalp massage is a thing and not only related to DT.

Thanks

yea thats it. you have to do it really gently most of the time, especially first few minutes of each session. i start by massaging the parts that have most hair and then work my way up till "the ridge" is guess ( the most top part of the skull). ayurvedic(?) massaging and the end - its just tapping fast but gently the skin ( for lymph or whatever). you have to concentrate on the feeling when you are massaging is guess. i hope it helps


EDIT - ayurvedic "at" the end not and

Thanks for the reply

You massage gently, not firmly?  I plant my fingers firmly on my scalp so they don't slide and cause hair breakage, but I thought you were supposed to go deep and forceful with the massages to really get in there and break up the fibrosis/calcification?  If I listen to my bodily feedback I think that I'm doing fine with this amount of force, since there's no "pain", just pressure when I press, then relaxation when I release.  

Or did you mean a deep massage as I described when you said Ayurvedic, isn't that kind of what it is?  Sorry to misunderstand  

Thanks again, looking forward to your progress photos you mentioned, good luck

EDIT: Good point about the lack of sensation at the beginning, you're right, if I was doing it to cause pain I wouldn't know

yea its hard to explain in words... you are right tho. you have to go "deep" thats good but "firmly " is what ? hard ? or do you mean firmly is for not sliding ? then you are right again. its just hard to explain in text. i do it gently the first few minutes, then i go "deep" for next few minutes. and gently/concentrate on feeling/ relaxation/ ayurvedic at the end. hope you what i mean

You are an idiot if you believe that DT is not causing hairloss. I've explained time and time again (with sources to back up my claims) why mechanical force (pressing and pinching) is crushing follicles and triggering an inflammatory response. Honestly, I can't debate with people like you because you're dumb as fuck. The guy has openly stated that his hairloss has gotten ten times worse since doing this for a mere three months, yet you choose to ignore this.

Anyways, I wont get into another shit slinging contest because dumb asses just can't see sense. It's the equivalent of pissing against the wind. It just irks me that pricks like you push your lies onto others and cause them to suffer even worse baldness as a result.

Oh and as for your “photophobia”, you mean you're a lying cunt with no pics to back up your claims. Would you happen to know Complexx by any chance?

Xenon wrote:Anyways, I wont get into another shit slinging contest because dumb asses just can't see sense

How many times have you said that and how many times have you come back?

Why are you so hostile?  I did not insult you at all man, take a chill pill or make a thread specifically for being against DT, this is a thread for help with DT/volunteers

EDIT:  Oops my post didn't go through

@florain:  Yes by firmly I mean hard, so my fingers don't slide and create friction on my scalp to break hairs.  Thanks again.