Re: Grow New Hair! (The original Papilla Power??)

hellwig Sat Apr 14, 2012 6:49 pm

I dont know if I used too much or even if there is actually such a thing as using too much. The burning stopped after 30 minutes, and I've read that was to be expected.

Hoppipolla Sat Apr 14, 2012 11:07 pm

hellwig wrote:I dont know if I used too much or even if there is actually such a thing as using too much. The burning stopped after 30 minutes, and I've read that was to be expected.

hehe, maybe next we should try hydrochloric acid! rofl xD

crysanthium Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:55 am

Just contributing ... I've been using the towel method for about 5-6 weeks and now keep a brush in my car and brush when I drive sometimes. Observations so far:

1. My scalp was very sensitive where I was thinning when i started. I actually cut small abrasions from towel rubbing at first and a boar bristle brush kinda hurt even used lightly. Now neither happens and the brushing actually feels good.

2. My hair has been thinned further in some areas that I've brushed out. However some areas near my hairline that were not growing hair have some new hairs coming in.

3. I don't notice itchiness from eating poorly as much anymore. When it has happened its pretty much gone after brushing / toweling that day.

Ill report any other changes noticed as they come up.

gg4545 Sun Apr 15, 2012 5:58 am

hellwig check out the pm i sent you

hellwig Sun Apr 15, 2012 10:21 am

gg4545 wrote:hellwig check out the pm i sent you

Done.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/2502580/

http://www.livestrong.com/article/236321-how-to-increase-circulation-to-the-skin-naturally/

Hoppipolla Sun Apr 15, 2012 1:04 pm

whoa I just brushed the front of my hair (temples, hairline) with that mega hard boar bristle brush (it proper scratches >.<) and so much blood went up there! lol

Looking forward to getting the same brush as ferox though as I'm sure it's a bit softer!! This is like bloody... sandpaper!! xD

It'll be good to have a go with the same brush as ferox though as it seems like that has a very good strength/toughness to it, so it will give me an idea what is optimal (or close to it) to use.

I may even get my hair cut a bit shorter so I can reach the scalp easier, I'm not sure Smile

Aum Sun Apr 15, 2012 1:22 pm

hoppipolla wrote:whoa I just brushed the front of my hair (temples, hairline) with that mega hard boar bristle brush (it proper scratches >.<) and so much blood went up there! lol

Looking forward to getting the same brush as ferox though as I'm sure it's a bit softer!! This is like bloody... sandpaper!! xD

It'll be good to have a go with the same brush as ferox though as it seems like that has a very good strength/toughness to it, so it will give me an idea what is optimal (or close to it) to use.

I may even get my hair cut a bit shorter so I can reach the scalp easier, I'm not sure

Hoppi
I'd definitely cut the hair. I had long hair, and then cut it way short. Brushing on shorter hair, in my opinion, makes a big difference. I can feel a noticeably greater scalp stimulation with short hair.

ferox Sun Apr 15, 2012 9:41 pm

yeah, you should cut your hair, otherwise it is not easy to reach your scalp. My hair is extremeley thick and short but I still have problems to reach my scalp on the crown and at the back.

Hoppipolla Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:03 pm

well, maybe Smile

If I like a certain style though I'll make sure to keep it - hell, what's the point in having hair if you can't style it how you want? Smile

Hoppipolla Mon Apr 16, 2012 6:13 am

And wow it is amazing how long my skin feels warm after brushing for... I'm using the cheapy brush and it's still really warm O.O

I brushed it about erm... nearly 45 minutes ago? Wow!

Delphine Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:55 pm

You don't need to cut your hair Hoppipolla. You might find it easier to brush by doing it the way George Michael (a well known hair expert) recommends, bending from the waist.
If you do, detangle your hair first, then brush in the bent at the waist position, brushing from nape down to the ends. Follow each swipe of your brush with the palm of your other hand. This cuts the static caused by the brushing. My son has longer hair too and he brushes his hair this way. When he remembers to brush at all Wink

It's true that brushing makes a big difference. I learned this way back when I first started taking charge of my hair, as a preteen. I read about boar bristles being best and it was on the
top of my Christmas wish list. I got it and used it big time. After having been ruined by perms when I was a kid, my hair got healthy, shiny, and long. Reading through this thread has
been a good reminder to get back to the 100 strokes a day, using the George Michael method! Very Happy

Oh, about niacin. I'm taking 3 grams a day, but never thought of applying it to my scalp. I think the boost in circulation from the flushing is helpful for hair in itself. Niacin has many other
benefits. A good site for learning about niacin is doctoryourself.com.

Hoppipolla Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:39 pm

Delphine wrote:
You don't need to cut your hair Hoppipolla. You might find it easier to brush by doing it the way George Michael (a well known hair expert) recommends, bending from the waist.
If you do, detangle your hair first, then brush in the bent at the waist position, brushing from nape down to the ends. Follow each swipe of your brush with the palm of your other hand. This cuts the static caused by the brushing. My son has longer hair too and he brushes his hair this way. When he remembers to brush at all

It's true that brushing makes a big difference. I learned this way back when I first started taking charge of my hair, as a preteen. I read about boar bristles being best and it was on the
top of my Christmas wish list. I got it and used it big time. After having been ruined by perms when I was a kid, my hair got healthy, shiny, and long. Reading through this thread has
been a good reminder to get back to the 100 strokes a day, using the George Michael method!

Oh, about niacin. I'm taking 3 grams a day, but never thought of applying it to my scalp. I think the boost in circulation from the flushing is helpful for hair in itself. Niacin has many other
benefits. A good site for learning about niacin is doctoryourself.com.

Aw thanks so much for that post ^_^

Yeah I mean, I hate being forced to style my hair in certain ways or look a certain way - self-expression is very important to me ^_^

So erm, where can I read more about this method? Maybe I'll just Google it?

Looking forward to getting stuck into all this! I need thick hair at the front of the top again as it's sooo thin!! It's still not that noticeable (my housemate still thinks I'm making it up lol) but that's just because my hair is naturally thick and still long. In a year, at my current rate of thinning, it would end up looking AWFUL >.<

I wanna catch it before that happens! Smile

So yeah thank you!

Delphine Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:47 am

A bit more about the brushing technique:

Brush your hair twice a day. Dr. George Michael teaches that brushing stimulates hair follicles and promotes hair growth. Brushing also conditions, because it distributes scalp sebum, a natural lubricant, throughout the hair. The George Michael brushing technique has you bend at the waist and smooth your hair in front of you. Brush your hair from the nape of the neck to the ends in slow, gentle strokes. Follow each brush stroke with your free hand to prevent the buildup of static. Brush your hair 100 times. After you finish, stand up and brush your hair from the ends to the roots to neaten it.

Read more: How to Care for Long Hair Using the Dr. George Michael Method | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_4507211_care-long-hair-using-dr.html#ixzz1sELSNf7a

Brush all over your head.
That's it. Happy brushing, happy hair, Hoppipolla! Very Happy

Delphine Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:49 am

Delphine wrote:
A bit more about the brushing technique:

Brush your hair twice a day. Dr. George Michael teaches that brushing stimulates hair follicles and promotes hair growth. Brushing also conditions, because it distributes scalp sebum, a natural lubricant, throughout the hair. The George Michael brushing technique has you bend at the waist and smooth your hair in front of you. Brush your hair from the nape of the neck to the ends in slow, gentle strokes. Follow each brush stroke with your free hand to prevent the buildup of static. Brush your hair 100 times. After you finish, stand up and brush your hair from the ends to the roots to neaten it.

Read more: How to Care for Long Hair Using the Dr. George Michael Method | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_4507211_care-long-hair-using-dr.html#ixzz1sELSNf7a

Brush all over your head.
I personally like to pull my hair a bit in the process, while running my fingers through my hair, for more scalp stimulation/hair growth.
That's it. Happy brushing, happy hair, Hoppipolla!

Hoppipolla Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:20 am

Delphine wrote:
Delphine wrote:
A bit more about the brushing technique:

Brush your hair twice a day. Dr. George Michael teaches that brushing stimulates hair follicles and promotes hair growth. Brushing also conditions, because it distributes scalp sebum, a natural lubricant, throughout the hair. The George Michael brushing technique has you bend at the waist and smooth your hair in front of you. Brush your hair from the nape of the neck to the ends in slow, gentle strokes. Follow each brush stroke with your free hand to prevent the buildup of static. Brush your hair 100 times. After you finish, stand up and brush your hair from the ends to the roots to neaten it.

Read more: How to Care for Long Hair Using the Dr. George Michael Method | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_4507211_care-long-hair-using-dr.html#ixzz1sELSNf7a

Brush all over your head.
I personally like to pull my hair a bit in the process, while running my fingers through my hair, for more scalp stimulation/hair growth.
That's it. Happy brushing, happy hair, Hoppipolla!

hm, yeah maybe I'll give it a go!

My hair on the top is definitely looking thin atm Sad

I think all the messing around with it has made a lot of hairs come out. HOWEVER it does look and feel quite "busy" up there, like stubbly and stuff. So maybe there are lots of new hairs coming through. However, my hair often feels "stubbly" underneath (obviously a good sign!), so it's hard to tell if that's what it is or not. I'll keep it up anyway, and try not to let the thinning get to me Smile

Thank you for all the pointers - knowledge definitely is power! If I can just get success with my hair then that will be a huge weight off my mind and I can take my time slowly healing my body. As much as I cared and had faith in the systemic health approaches, because I was so desperate to fix my hair I kept getting impatient and then one night I would feel a bit down because my hair was still struggling, and pig out on something I shouldn't have pigged out on xD

So... at the moment it's looking like "hair first, health later"!! Smile

Delphine Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:10 pm

"Hair first, health later"? How does that work? Question

So... at the moment it's looking like "hair first, health later"!!

Hoppipolla Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:48 pm

Delphine wrote:"Hair first, health later"? How does that work?

So... at the moment it's looking like "hair first, health later"!!

hehe well, of course I am still thinking about my health (good diet, some supps like colostrum and pau d'arco, etc), but I think I was getting so fixated on my health I forgot that my hair is by far the main thing bothering me. If I could even just "stick a band-aid" on that problem I'd feel a hell of a lot better and feel much more like my body is working WITH me again not against me!

It's a long road though eh? Smile

Delphine Tue Apr 17, 2012 2:25 pm

Keep the faith! What you can conceive, you can achieve. Hold the vision of you with a fine head of hair. Say to yourself, "Every day in every way, my hair is getting better and better."
(Or come up with your own affirmation.) Say it even if you don't feel it at first. As you keep saying it and holding the vision, it shall manifest.
Let that be your band-aid, along with the George Michael brushing method.

Hair's to your hair! Very Happy

NeonMonk Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:12 pm

My hair on the top is definitely looking thin atm Sad I think all the messing around with it has made a lot of hairs come out.

My hair is looking A LOT thinner since starting Margo's Towel Method and massaging. The hair is especially thinner where I was already thinning and I have lost quite a bit of hair.

But according to Papilla Power, Margo, and Bernarr Macfadden this is normal when starting scalp stimulation. Man it's scary, and it sucks, but, apparently, it's part of the process. I'm sure you're already aware of this Hoppipolla, but I'm posting to remind myself and others that are on scalp stimulation to not lose heart and keep at it. I think the worst any of us could do is give up so early in the experiment.

According to the literature, it takes 3-4 months for the Papilla to get enough nourishment to start pushing new hair through. And, obviously, the papilla is only going to be getting enough blood where the capillaries are sufficiently active and restored.

A small excerpt from the Hair Culture book:

Dead hairs should never be allowed to remain in the scalp; they should be plucked as soon as they can be easily removed. Under these circumstances, if they are removed another hair ALWAYS GROWS from the same follicle or root sheath. But if this dead hair is allowed to remain until it falls out on its own accord, it often kills the root, and the hair never grows again. Therefore, when hair shows an inclination to come out in excessive quantities, the first duty is to pull out all that can be easily removed.

Thousands of men, and women, too, have suffered from permanent loss of hair simply on account of their extraordinary endeavors to retain dead hair in the scalp the moment that the discovery is made that the hair is coming out in excessive quantities. They are afraid to brush it--afraid to wash the scalp--afraid almost to touch it because of an erroneous impression that these dead hairs should be retained. They use every possible means in their endeavors to retain these hair "corpses," the roots of which in may instances decay and kill the life of germs that otherwise would have blossomed forth into new hairs.
Dead hairs should be plucked out for the same reason that rotten apples are removed from the sound ones--that the corrupting dead is everywhere conveyed from the presence of the living.
A five-minute massage of the scalp, night and morning, using with a rotary motion, the tips of the fingers solidly placed on the scalp, also has a very beneficial effect. Pinching the skin and gently moving every part of the scalp back and forth, to loosen it, also stimulates the circulation in the most effective manner.

hellwig Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:25 pm

Great post neon. I said before that it's like I'm growing a new baby hair for every hair I shed which is reducing density in the short term. It's nice to get some theory behind it. I came up with the scalp pinching myself, so it's interesting how it's in the book. The massage is the same as Oleda Baker suggest, which I'm doing already as well. The 3 months for regrowth doesnt fit with me since I've been growing brand new hair from one week in.

Hoppipolla Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:50 am

So... am I right in saying that the reason the top of the head sheds way more than the sides is because blood flow is worse (galea region? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galea_aponeurotica ) and not due to some genetic difference between the follicles in these two areas? Additionally, hair loss starts at the temples and crown because they have the worst blood flow of the entire scalp?

ferox Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:03 am

hoppipolla wrote:So... am I right in saying that the reason the top of the head sheds way more than the sides is because blood flow is worse (galea region? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galea_aponeurotica ) and not due to some genetic difference between the follicles in these two areas? Additionally, hair loss starts at the temples and crown because they have the worst blood flow of the entire scalp?

And I think that this is the reason why transplated hair won't fall out because they are transplanted into a deeper region where is more bloodflow! I am losing more and more the believe that DHT or the genetics is the reason for MPB....

Hoppipolla Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:10 am

ferox wrote:And I think that this is the reason why transplated hair won't fall out because they are transplanted into a deeper region where is more bloodflow! I am losing more and more the believe that DHT or the genetics is the reason for MPB....

Well, I think I do still believe it's DHT and genetics, but maybe all this stuff is the kind of "straw that breaks the camel's back" and completes the process.

Perhaps the reason for the restricted blood flow is the fibrous tissue of the galea region.

SlowMoe Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:05 am

I believe this is why we lose hair in the galea region

http://www.worldhairloss.org/index.php/hairloss/page2-featuredcontributors/the_mechanics_of_male_pattern_baldness

Hoppipolla Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:32 am

SlowMoe wrote:I believe this is why we lose hair in the galea region

http://www.worldhairloss.org/index.php/hairloss/page2-featuredcontributors/the_mechanics_of_male_pattern_baldness

Jesus this is f'ing clever stuff!! I should have read this before! Smile

EDIT -- Ok just finished. WOW. VERY very impressive.

I think it's true as well Smile

What I can't quite grasp though is WHY those muscles would be in this state of continuous tension. I really do believe that DHT is playing a role SOMEWHERE here (due to the increase in body hair that everyone seems to have at the same time, and the effectiveness of antiandrogens), and everyone seems to have infection as well such as dandruff. I think this is a very solid aspect of a complex biological tapestry that comes together to result in MPB...

I also always did find it interesting that mine started right after my skin "thinned" (less collagen). Wow... frustrating that we're all SO close but I still don't think we understand the whole thing start to finish for sure do we?

Sorry... DOUBLE EDIT -- My best guess is that this is not actually the CAUSE of MPB as such (otherwise, why don't women get it?) but that it runs concurrently with the cause of MPB and makes the galea reason more SUSCEPTIBLE to hair loss than the back, sides, or rest of the body. Then, when the androgens flood the follicles and increase sebum for infections or whatever it is that they do, the poor old follicles at the top are already fairly blood-starved so just keel over really quickly. That's my best guess.

Additionally, I just made this: http://www.libertyhost.org/thebestofimmortalhair

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