Pathogenesis Of Male Pattern Baldness & The Solutions.

The following was written by MisterE. I realize he was banned from this forum, and I'm not trying to stir the pot here and cause problems, as I have much respect for CS and the others on this forum. But whether you agree with him or not, this is a very well-written article that he wrote here and I think it summarizes the MPB issue very well, and whether you love the guy or hate him, it's definitely worth the read.

This was posted today on Hair Loss Help forum:
http://www.hairlosshelp.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=10&threadid=97393&enterthread=y

The pathogenesis of male-pattern-baldness (MPB) is the same as acne. The first step in acne is a condition called follicular-hyperkeratinization or hyperkeratosis. Simply put, this means excess skin production inside and around the hair-follicle. The next step is caused by excess sebum production, followed by P.Acnes infestation of the pilosebaceous-follicle, with subsequent inflammation. So to summarize, MPB, just like acne, is caused by four main factors: (1) follicular-hyperkeratinization, (2) excess sebum production, (3) P.Acnes, and (4) inflammation [1].

Free-IGF-1 (insulin-like-growth-factor-1) stimulates the proliferation of keratinocytes (skin cells below the scalp). As the keratinocytes mature, they migrate to the top of the scalp and become what is known as corneocytes. If all goes well, the corneocytes are supposed to be shed off the scalp in a process called apoptosis. The shedding of corneocytes or the apoptosis of corneocytes, is under the influence of IGFBP-3 (insulin-like-growth-factor-binding-protein-3) and endogenous retinoids. In men with male-pattern-baldness, they have excess free-IGF-1 and not enough IGFBP-3 [2]. The result of this is hyperkeratinization; too much skin production, and not enough skin exfoliation. This causes the hair-follicle to be blocked by excess skin. Free-IGF-1 is required for keratinocyte proliferation in humans [3] and too much IGF-1 results in hyperkeratosis [4].

Free-testosterone stimulates sebum production by converting into DHT (dihydrotestosterone) within the sebaceous-glands. Both insulin and free-IGF-1 can not only stimulate the synthesis of androgens from testicular-tissue [5] [6], but high levels of both insulin and free-IGF-1 also inhibit the livers production of SHBG (sex-hormone-binding globulin) [7] [8]. SHBG is shown to be lower in men and woman with androgenic-alopecia (MPB) [9-13]. As SHBG goes up, free-testosterone goes down. As free-testosterone goes down, less is available to be converted into DHT. With less DHT comes less sebaceous-activity.

So far I have shown that a lack of IGFBP-3 (and excess free-IGF-1) causes hyperkeratinization of hair-follicles. And that low levels of SHBG promote excess sebum production. Next, after combining these two scenarios, we get P.Acnes infiltration. You see, the excess skin is now blocking not only the hair-follicle from sprouting out of the scalp, but now, also the flow or excretion of sebum. As a consequence, the sebum builds-up within the pilosebaceous-follicle. With this anaerobic-environment caused by the hyperkeratosis and with all this trapped excess sebum, the situation becomes the perfect breeding ground for a bacterium named P.Acnes, which feeds off the trapped sebum. The body is smart and the immune-system detects these nasty critters and attacks them with inflammation [14]. This explains why Nizoral-shampoo seems to be effective in controlling the symptoms of MPB [15]. The active ingredient in Nizoral-shampoo is ketoconazole, which has been shown to kill P.Acnes [16].

The solution to this cascade of events, would be to obviously lower your free-IGF-1 activity. Lowering free-IGF-1 would, (1) decrease the IGF-1:IGFBP-3 ratio, and (2) increase SHBG, thus preventing hyperkeratinization of the hair-follicles and excess sebum production. Preventing hyperkeratosis and sebum production would prevent P.acnes infestation and the subsequent inflammation that follows.

So how does one lower free-IGF-1 levels? Studies are consistent in showing that a vegan-diet causes both a decrease in IGF-1 and an increase in SHBG [17-31]. Many of these studies indicate that vegans have higher SHBG and lower IGF-1 despite the fact they are consuming high-fat diets, like eating lots of nuts or avocados. I personally believe that an extremely-low-fat vegan diet is optimal, due to the fact that dietary-fat causes insulin-resistance. Insulin-resistance causes high-insulin and IGF-1 in the blood. I also believe that fructose should be limited as much as possible. Fructose readily converts into fat in the liver, in a process called de-novo-lipogenesis and once again, fat paralyzes insulin-action, thus keeping it in the blood for extended periods of time, instead of driving glucose into the cells. Animal-protein, especially protein from dairy-products, rich in methionine, casein, and essential amino-acids seems to be the best stimulator of IGF-1. This explains why vegan-diets, low in "high-quality" protein increase SHBG and decrease IGF-1 regardless of fat content. With that stated I personally believe with all of my heart, that you would get the best results with a diet consisting only of beans, whole-grains and vegetables. Nuts and fruit (fat and sugar) should be eaten rarely.

Avoiding dairy-products is of huge importance! Nothing increases free-IGF-1 more than dairy-products; this has been consistently shown over and over again in the scientific-literature. And this should come as no surprise, considering the purpose of milk is to stimulate rapid-growth, development and maturity of the newborn. Dairy-products also contain DHT precursors [32] [33] and potent estrogens [34-36].

After over 30 years of nutritional dogma barking over and over again that "diet has nothing to do with acne". Recent research has proven beyond a doubt, that diet does affect acne and that dairy-products and high-fat, sugar-laden processed-food are the largest culprits [37-45]. And since the pathology of MPB and acne are identical, any type of diet that promotes acne has the potential to promote MPB in genetically-predisposed people.

Eating a low-fat, low-fructose, high-fiber vegan-diet high in complex-carbohydrates should stop the progression of MPB hormonally. However this is unlikely to get rid of all the follicular-hyperkeratinization that has already occurred over time. To reverse hyperkeratosis, exfoliate the scalp and regrow "lost" hair, I highly suggest using glycolic-acid topically. Glycolic-acid is what's called an alpha-hydroxy-acid. Alpha-hydroxy-acids are shown to diminish corneocyte cohesion, induce exfoliation and reverse hyperkeratosis [46]. This should promote regrowth. I've been using glycolic-acid since the beginning of the year (along with my complex-carbohydrate-vegan-diet), I have removed a copious amount of dead-skin-cell "build-up" from my scalp. Nearly three-grams of dead-skin so far! And my hair has drastically thickened! I'm completely convinced this is the correct way to combat MPB.

So to rehash or recap everything said here: a high level of free-IGF-1 (caused by eating a high-fat, high-protein, rich western-diet) causes follicular-hyperkeratinization and down-regulation of SHBG. Low SHBG correlates with the metabolic-syndrome [47-51] and promotes excess sebum production. Excess sebum is trapped, along with the hair-follicle, beneath the excess skin (produced by over-expression of IGF-1), this gives rise to P.Acnes; a bacterium that feeds off sebum and generates inflammation from the immune-system. Eating a diet consisting of beans, whole-grains and vegetables will drastically decrease IGF-1 and increase SHBG, preventing any further progression of MPB. Glycolic-acid used topically will reverse the hyperkeratosis already present and promote regrowth.

I would also like to close by saying that the effects of the complex-carbohydrate-vegan-diet can be magnified by practicing intermediate-fasting, exercise, getting plenty of sunshine exposure on the body and drinking nothing but water and organic-green-tea.




[1] Implications for the role of diet in acne.

[2] Vertex balding, plasma insulin-like growth factor 1, and insulin-like growth factor binding protein 3.

[3] The role of IGF-I in human skin and its appendages: morphogen as well as mitogen?

[4] Overexpression of insulin-like growth factor-1 induces hyperplasia, dermal abnormalities, and spontaneous tumor formation in transgenic mice.

[5] Short-term exposure to insulin-like growth factors stimulates testosterone production by testicular interstitial cells.

[6] Regulation of testicular function by insulin and transforming growth factor-beta.

[7] Effect of insulin-like growth factor-type 1 (IGF-1) and insulin on the secretion of sex hormone binding globulin and IGF-1-binding protein (IBP-1) by human hepatoma cells.

[8] Differential effects of insulin and insulin-like growth factor 1 on the production of plasma steroid-binding globulins by human hepatoblastoma-derived (Hep G2) cells.

[9] Hormonal profile of men with premature balding.

[10] Hormonal profile in men with premature androgenic alopecia.

[11] Serum testosterone and sex hormone binding globulin levels in women with androgenetic alopecia.

[12] Sex hormone-binding globulin and saliva testosterone levels in men with androgenetic alopecia.

[13] Low sex-hormone binding globulin levels in young women with diffuse hair loss.

[14] Induction of proinflammatory cytokines by a soluble factor of Propionibacterium acnes: implications for chronic inflammatory acne.

[15] Ketoconazole shampoo: effect of long-term use in androgenic alopecia.

[16] In vitro activities of azole antifungal agents against Propionibacterium acnes isolated from patients with acne vulgaris.

[17] Diet and Sex Hormone-Binding Globulin.

[18] Effects of replacing meat with soyabean in the diet on sex hormone concentrations in healthy adult males.

[19] The effects of low-protein diet and testosterone on sex hormone-binding globulin capacity in male rabbits.

[20] Long-term low-protein, low-calorie diet and endurance exercise modulate metabolic factors associated with cancer risk.

[21] Effects of dietary protein content on IGF-I, testosterone, and body composition during 8 days of severe energy deficit and arduous physical activity.

[22] The effects of dietary protein on serum IGF-1 levels in adult humans.

[23] Dietary correlates of plasma insulin-like growth factor I and insulin-like growth factor binding protein 3 concentrations.

[24] Determinants of circulating insulin-like growth factor I and insulin-like growth factor binding protein 3 concentrations in a cohort of Singapore men and women.

[25] The influence of dietary intake on the insulin - like growth factor (IGF) system across three ethnic groups: a population - based study.

[26] The associations of diet with serum insulin - like growth factor I and its main binding proteins in 292 women meat - eaters, vegetarians, and vegans.

[27] Relationship of Dietary Protein and Soy Isoflavones to Serum IGF-1 and IGF Binding Proteins in the Prostate Cancer Lifestyle Trial.

[28] Long-term effects of calorie or protein restriction on serum IGF-1 and IGFBP-3 concentration in humans.

[29] The low-methionine content of vegan diets may make methionine restriction feasible as a life extension strategy.

[30] A low-fat, whole-food vegan diet, as well as other strategies that down-regulate IGF-I activity, may slow the human aging process.

[31] Hormones and diet: low insulin-like growth factor-I but normal bioavailable androgens in vegan men.

[32] Acne, dairy and cancer: The 5alpha-P link.

[33] A survey of the steroids in cows' milk.

[34] Estrone and 17beta-estradiol concentrations in pasteurized-homogenized milk and commercial dairy products.

[35] Concentrations of 17beta-estradiol in Holstein whole milk.

[36] Exposure to exogenous estrogen through intake of commercial milk produced from pregnant cows.

[37] Acne vulgaris: a disease of Western civilization.

[38] Does diet really affect acne?

[39] The association of acne vulgaris with diet.

[40] High school dietary dairy intake and teenage acne.

[41] Evidence for acne-promoting effects of milk and other insulinotropic dairy products.

[42] Role of insulin, insulin-like growth factor-1, hyperglycaemic food and milk consumption in the pathogenesis of acne vulgaris.

[43] Permanent impairment of insulin resistance from pregnancy to adulthood: the primary basic risk factor of chronic Western diseases.

[44] Milk--the promoter of chronic Western diseases.

[45] Nutrition and acne.

[46] Hyperkeratinization, corneocyte cohesion, and alpha hydroxy acids.

[47] Relationships of circulating sex-hormone-binding globulin with metabolic traits in humans.

[48] Testosterone and sex hormone-binding globulin predict the metabolic syndrome and diabetes in middle-aged men.

[49] Lower sex hormone-binding globulin is more strongly associated with metabolic syndrome than lower total testosterone in older men: the health in men study.

[50] The triad of erectile dysfunction, hypogonadism and the metabolic syndrome.

[51] Association of testosterone and sex hormone-binding globulin with metabolic syndrome and insulin resistance in men.


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MPB is caused by follicular-hyperkeratinization!

misterE protocol
1. Eat only vegetables, whole-grains, beans and drink only water.
2. Exercise in the sunshine.
3. Intermediate fasting.
4. Apply glycolic-acid to the scalp.

Yeah, first of all, I wish he had links for all his references, but it is the same thing all over again. So I just picked a reference at random, [47] for instance "Relationships of circulating sex-hormone-binding globulin with metabolic traits in humans." Basically, he's not reading or going through the references with a fine tooth comb.

Abstract

OBJECTIVE Recent data suggested that sex hormone–binding globulin (SHBG) levels decrease when fat accumulates in the liver and that circulating SHBG may be causally involved in the pathogenesis of type 2 diabetes in humans. In the present study, we investigated mechanisms by which high SHBG may prevent development to diabetes.

CONCLUSIONS
Possible mechanisms by which high circulating SHBG prevents the development of type 2 diabetes involve regulation of fasting glycemia but not alteration of insulin secretory function.

He's making a valid point, but he really doesn't need all those references, especially when they contradict his opinion.

I second tonyj - The bulk of the good research comes from this source below:

http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/EvolutionPaleolithic/Role%20of%20diet%20in%20acne.pdf

However, I must say that diet alone is not going to cut it, because we live in an incredibly toxic environment. For example, heavy metals, lotions, creams, various products with contaminants that are both absorbed or inhaled. This plays role in oxidative stress.

From the standpoint of a vegan diet, it would be a mistake in my estimation of avoiding animal fats, such as sources of vitamin A not beta carotene). There are lots of reasons for this.

Finally the stress factor.

Looks like MisterE changed his opinion on a few things.

These types of posts tend to throw me for a loop.

So is a high level of IGF-1 really a bad thing? It seems that IGF-1 would be nothing but beneficial
unless it becomes too high. But I've seen plenty of men who display characteristics of high levels of IGF-1 and have no hair problems whatsoever. Perhaps it becomes a problem when IGF-1 is elevated too high long after puberty.

Perhaps IGF and insulin sharing receptor sites can lead to problems when insulin resistance is present.
This may leave too many receptor sites open for IGF-1, leading to the problems talked about it in the post.

But I'm far from educated on these hormones. So some more insight would be great. Wouldn't it be more beneficial to increase insulin sensitivity than to try and lower our levels of IGF-1. It just seems like trying to lower a hormone that is so integral to HGH production would be ignorant. But, I could be the ignorant one.

MisterE was a little over zealous about this aspect as well. The truth is, without IGF-1, we cannot grow hair.

It's really all about balance. I can tell if I'm over doing it on IGF-1 precursors (i.e, Bovine Colostrum, Arginine Pyroglutamate) if my get raised bumps on my forehead and scalp. Generally, just improve glucose metabolism will resolve any concerns about excess IGF-1 unless the above mentioned products are taken for too long. Various plant based antioxidants do help improve glucose regulation.

There are many who cannot grow hair because of insufficient IGF-1.

Hey Caustic,

Thanks for the information, on this post and the antioxidant one. I appreciate it.

anthonyspencer54 wrote:These types of posts tend to throw me for a loop.

So is a high level of IGF-1 really a bad thing? It seems that IGF-1 would be nothing but beneficial
unless it becomes too high. But I've seen plenty of men who display characteristics of high levels of IGF-1 and have no hair problems whatsoever. Perhaps it becomes a problem when IGF-1 is elevated too high long after puberty.

Perhaps IGF and insulin sharing receptor sites can lead to problems when insulin resistance is present.
This may leave too many receptor sites open for IGF-1, leading to the problems talked about it in the post.

But I'm far from educated on these hormones. So some more insight would be great. Wouldn't it be more beneficial to increase insulin sensitivity than to try and lower our levels of IGF-1. It just seems like trying to lower a hormone that is so integral to HGH production would be ignorant. But, I could be the ignorant one.

You have to distinguish between systemic levels of IGF-1 and localized IGF-1 in the skin. When you have elevated levels of circulating IGF-1, then there's inhibition of SHBG synthesis and the result is higher levels of unbound androgens. Whereas IGF-1 in the scalp promotes hair growth. In fact DHT inhibits the release of IGF-1 from dermal papilla cells in the hair follicle. This is believed to be one of the mechanisms by which DHT inhibits hair growth in balding scalps.

I think there was a study about how combining oral cayenne and soy isoflavones promotes IGF-1 production in the skin.

Imprisoned radical.....
aghhhhh you may have cleared up the confusion with the conflicting information i have been reading about insulin like growth factor 1.

So in the studies CS previously cited...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10827403
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10025745

were the above measuring systemic insulin like growth factor one? (these point to the negative effects of IGF1 & balding)

while this one previously mentioned in the forum ....
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10025745

measuring localized scalp insulin like growth factor one? (This one implies a DEFICIENCY of IGF1 is partially to blame in balding)

I remember reading that the mechanism by which they think caloric restriction is effective in life extension is through a reduction in IGF-1.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14710349

Again this is probably targeting "systemic levels" ?

Interestingly...."The dominant dietary factors stimulating IGF-1 release are protein and energy intake … and energy intake may be of greater importance.” (Paul Jaminet)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6681614

So this begs me asking a very naive/stupid question.....is there a way to optimize IGF1 and bias it to be low in circulation while abundant in the scalp?

Here is another interesting video that comes from Dr. Mcdougall. ( A vegan doctor)
Now i am not by any means endorsing a vegan diet because in my very modest opinion i feel its sub-optimal but this doctors brief lecture on IGF1 may be some food for thought.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHYFOJBU434

Interestingly he implicates soy as raising IGF1 MORE than dairy. However he is targeting isolated soy protein. Im totally ignorant to the difference between this and concentrated soy isoflavones.

granger451,

I think your observations are correct.

Unfortunately I think stopping hair loss might be more complicated than increasing SHBG via decreasing levels of IGF-1. Even at physiological concentrations, insulin (just like IGF-1) inhibits the synthesis of SHBG in the liver. So that means that hyperinsulinemia can also contribute to decreased SHBG levels.

I think MisterE's paper presents a good reason to reconsider including dairy in one's diet.

I wonder if MisterE's claim about veganism resulting in higher levels of SHBG is true. I'll look into his studies some time this week.

MisterE's position is essentially based on the androgen-based interpretation of MPB though. Significantly increasing SHBG levels and thereby decreasing levels of free circulating androgens could have many of the negative health effects associated with drugs/foods that alter hormone-metabolism (ie., finasteride).

This stuff is very complicated.

High levels of vitamin D are also associated with lowered SHBG. I lay out in the sun for 30 minutes one day, and I couldn't stop getting boners every few hours for the next several days. I would be fine with this if it wasn't for the possibility that the increased levels of free androgens could also be destroying my hair follicles.

MisterE claims that studies 17-31 support his claim that low-fat vegan diets increase SHBG. Let's verify this.

Here's number 17:

Diet and sex hormone-binding globulin.
Longcope C, Feldman HA, McKinlay JB, Araujo AB.
Source

University of Massachusetts Medical School, Worcester 01655, USA.
Abstract

The serum concentration of sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) is inversely related to weight and in animal studies is inversely related to protein intake. As SHBG can affect the biological activity of testosterone and estradiol, we wished to determine the role of protein intake on SHBG levels in men. Using data from the Massachusetts Male Aging Study we examined cross-sectional relationships between dietary components and SHBG levels in 1552 men (aged 40-70 yr) for whom these factors were known. Analyzed by multiple regression, controlling for testosterone and estradiol levels, age (P<0.001) and fiber intake (P = 0.02) were positively correlated to SHBG concentration, whereas body mass index (P<0.001) and protein intake (P<0.03) were negatively correlated to SHBG concentration. The intakes of calories, fat (animal or vegetable), and carbohydrate were not related to SHBG concentration. We conclude that age and body mass index are major determinants of SHBG concentrations in older men, and fiber and protein intake are also significant contributors to SHBG levels, but total caloric intake and the intake of carbohydrate or fat are not significant. Thus, diets low in protein in elderly men may lead to elevated SHBG levels and decreased testosterone bioactivity. The decrease in bioavailable testosterone can then result in declines in sexual function and muscle and red cell mass, and contribute to the loss of bone density.

Doesn't really support MisterE's claim. Maybe we could all pitch in and go through the rest of the studies he cited, and perhaps work together to find more information on how we can optimize SHBG levels.

There's a positive correlation between age and SHBG levels. This makes me doubt if SHBG levels are a major determining factor in AGA, since the prevalence of AGA only increases in older men.

imprisoned-radical wrote:
Maybe we could all pitch in and go through the rest of the studies he cited, and perhaps work together to find more information on how we can optimize SHBG levels.

I can take 1 - 10. ill go through them tonight after work and see if there is anything there.

Sure i can take #11-15. Ill post a reply by the weekend.

I do think he's got a point on Dairy and IGF1 but that definately doesn't make me jump toward his conclusion of a vegan diet.

Heres a paper though somewhat along the lines of his thought on milk:

http://www.acnehelp.org.uk/papers/Commentary.pdf

outside of the IGF-1, on DHT...

"This sequence results in milk that contains not only placenta-derived progesterone but also other dihydrotestosterone (DHT) precursors, including 5a-pregnanedione and 5a-androstanedione. These compounds are only a few enzymatic steps away from DHT (the accepted prime acnegen) and the enzymes required to mediate the change are present in the human pilobaceous unit.13 It had been hoped that 5a-reductase inhibitors might block the final common pathway to DHT that these enzymes feed into. Unfortunately, even if 5a-reductase is totally blocked, the blockade is of no value because these compounds have already undergone 5a-reduction— in the bovine mammary gland. "

This as well as its effects on IGF-1 was what convinced me to stay away from Milk. However cream and butter is ok in my book for now.
On the other hand Danny Roddy has detailed how raw unpasteurized milk is one of the few foods that can boost glutathione. I still stay away though.

Here's a diagram showing the pathways through which steroid hormones are metabolized.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Steroidogenesis.svg

The argument that milk shouldn't be consumed because it contains precursors of DHT isn't particularly convincing. Cholesterol is a metabolic precursor of DHT. But that doesn't mean we should eliminate it from our diets. Similarly testosterone is the only direct precursor of DHT...but that doesn't mean we should try lowering testosterone levels.

But I agree with you on the point about dairy raising IGF-1.

As far as the Glycolic Acid... wouldnt Retin-A work just as well to reverse the above cascade of skin issues?

Someone please answer that

itzmecorey wrote:As far as the Glycolic Acid... wouldnt Retin-A work just as well to reverse the above cascade of skin issues?

Someone please answer that

My order of glycolic acid arrives tomorrow. Never used Retin-A, but if I notice any positives with this I'll let you know.

This is actually very, very similar to my theories on the cause of MPB!

I thought that androgenic imbalance (quite possibly free T) caused increased DHT in hair follicles and therefore increased sebum, which provided a home to a range of organisms like bacteria, fungus, etc (which to me explained why some got a lot of dandruff and some don't). The reason for it being only in the MPB area I thought was possibly down to circulation in the scalp, as that area has the worst circulation.

That was just my theory though, I'm still learning fast. I also guessed that maybe these persistent infections might be coming from the gut, as not everyone with an oily scalp gets such aggressive infections.

I'm not sure, but that's just my 2 cents at the moment

Wow, I just read it in detail start to finish - misterE is so awesome xD

And so strange that he and I have both moved towards low fat vegan diets! Our reasoning was quite different though. My approach also includes a high amount of fructose, so there's a difference there.

When I was first losing hair and I went on HLT, misterE was the guy who like "kept me sane", because I was a bit of a wreck (so scared and worried about losing my hair ._. ) and he was much more positive and understanding than everyone else I think.

Anyway erm.. yeah it's all very interesting and this isn't the first time I've heard stories of miraculous, rapid recovery from very low fat vegan diets.

I'm definitely going to keep my eye on all this, particularly as misterE's conclusions are so similar to mine!!

To be honest, I think we are all so close to understanding MPB top to bottom. My best advice would be to NOT get too swept away or confused by the complexity of some stages of this and focus as much as possible on the core mechanism, as misterE has done here.

I look forward to seeing what comes out of this, and darn I hope he's right or at least mostly right!

Reply with quote

Re: Pathogenesis Of Male Pattern Baldness & The Solutions.

Post CausticSymmetry on Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:58 am
I second tonyj - The bulk of the good research comes from this source below:

http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/EvolutionPaleolithic/Role%20of%20diet%20in%20acne.pdf

However, I must say that diet alone is not going to cut it, because we live in an incredibly toxic environment. For example, heavy metals, lotions, creams, various products with contaminants that are both absorbed or inhaled. This plays role in oxidative stress.

From the standpoint of a vegan diet, it would be a mistake in my estimation of avoiding animal fats, such as sources of vitamin A not beta carotene). There are lots of reasons for this.

Finally the stress factor.

The acne study you pointed out, the one cited by Mr. E basically (for further study) made recommendations not to eat grains, cereal grains, processed foods, dairy, refined sugars and refined oils but instead eat a low hypoglycemic low carbohydrate diet composed mainly of unprocessed vegetables, fruit, lean meats and fish and seafood as therapeutic diet to battle acne, improve insulin metabolism and increase SHBG. Most people on the forum either know this intuitively based on their own self experiments on diets, or have accumulated this info from this forum.

I know CS pretty well and I wanted to post a little personal experience that will shed light on some of the factors discussed here. Well we are all biochemcially a little bit different, but there are some major commonalities:-

In late summer of 2010 I abandoned conventional urban living and moved up a mountain, way out in the wilderness, although thankfully near a village. No electricty, no running water. Just a cabin.

To combat stress I meditated daily and hit the gym for two short work outs at peak cortisol times. Hair loss slowed drastically, but did not stop 100%.

When I cut out ANY cooked oil, sebum production slashed and my hair loss stopped and my hair gradually become much thicker.

Whenever I ate ANY sugar or dairy (or weak grains), it was ALWAYS back to loss....

I began to do acupuncture with focus upon improving Kidney and by June of 2011 I had a full head of hair again.

Moronically, I moved back to a city and now 4 months later I can confurm three things - (i) that was the stupidest thing I ever did, (ii) no fat 80% raw vegan focussed diet with (non-grain) grass fed animal protein stopped hair loss even further (I know 1 and 2 are contradictory - they are) and (iii) any sugar devastated all my gains with weeks of damage

I now return to my mountain - with greater knowledge and humbled by my own massive stupidity, of having wasted such gains, and having to start again.

Dunking your head in sea water can help kill all pathogenic activity on the scalp, just don't leave it on too long.

Summary - Nature thrives, polution kills, sugar only more so.

@mastery How long is too long to dunk your head in seawater and why? Lots of surfers do it all the time and have plenty of hair.

Also, what's the point of having a thick head of hair if you're not around women and other people to enjoy it? I'm glad you reversed your loss but is living alone on a mountain worth it? Gotta be some sort of happy medium there.

Mastery, did you move to an island several years ago? There was someone on this forum who had a story similar to yours, I'm trying to remember who it was. Maybe The Natural. I'm starting to wonder if moving out of civilization is the only way to maintain good health for some people. Do you have any pictures showing the changes in your hair?

HI there to answer you both:-

(i) you can feel when it is too long, but remember my situation was unique, as yours is too. I had a full head of hair gradually thinning then OMG's laser pumped it back up but I carried on having cooked canola oil at Whole Foods deli's and eating sugar (chocolate) & eventually I ended up with white gooey, crud on my comb. LIterally white stuff on my scalp. Then using the Laser did not make my hair loss better when I had that such sebum and crud. If I recall, Jdp concurs re: Laser when high sebum - no!

Now with that out of the way, my use of sea water removed all that crud. Surreal, but true. I left it on at first over nght, sometimes two nights - but Gaunitz told me that while it is anti fungal leaving it on longer than 20 - 30 minutes can clog the follicle. So now I shampoo it off and I just "listen". Tonight I sprayed it on and could feel it killing the fungus. Just a great feeling of energy. As others may have noticed when you put sea water on your head almost no hairs come out when you comb it - unreal....! If it starts to itch wash it off. Personally when dunking I stand out there for 20 minutes or so. I was amazed absolutely no hairs come out... You'd think tons would but no, none. And yes when you shower in city water - ha! Loads do. Duh!!! So obvious in hindsight. I tested it, I took the sea water home and again no hairs, but try spraying you hair with city water - then comb it - ha!

My thinking is city water is garbage, and sea water contains fantastic minerals, plus it may well be ascerbic in helping to cut through and kill any pathogenic activity (fungus, parasites, bacteria). I've also noticed if I dunk it in cold ocean water right where the waves are crashing on the beach, the negative ions makes the scalp feel incredible. But then I screwed up, for as it felt so good I had a pizza and some sugar - BAD idea. - LOSS & more loss.

As for women, I'm a perfectionist and really focussed on my health right now. So I'm sticking with my German Shepherd for now, until the right 9 or 10 comes along. When the time is right I'm sure she will... Besides, there are huge pathogenic risks associated with being with a woman who eats normally (fungus, parasites etc), especially if you are immune compromised at all - and of course, huge immune benefits if she is into perfect health too. Granis or dairy or sugar? Just not interested! Why waste all your effort just for some ass - and I'm just not into rentals, although I can begin to understand why as guys get older are more picky they are...

(ii) Yes, I do not think you can have a full head of hair living in urban civilization unless you are exceptionally genetically blessed. Just look around there are just too many bald people, and every car spews CO etc.. Yes I have photos on my blackberry. You can see the front left temple thickening nicely until I moved back to USA and now its fucked again. I'm not comfortable posting photos on line but I've met CS and he knows how much hair I have. I'd say to be honest I lost 30 - 40% from Feb 2009 to August 2010, when I left the city. Then by June 2011 I had about 80 - 90% back, no recession, temples and crown nicely thicker and filled in and now I've lost my gains by being a moron and breaking all my rules.

In summary - you don't have to leave civilization just head to a sparsely populated place in nature with tons of negative ions - either the beach or the trees... - but you do have to give up civilized food - of that I am absolutely certain.

I am convinced nature and learning from her is the answer....

M