"the china study" high protein causes sickness, cancers.....hair loss?

hi CS and others..

what are your thoughts on this? it goes against all i believe in terms of good health.

low carb, no beans, no soy, no veggie proteins...

this book looks like its written by a anti meat Dr. with an agenda.

thoughts??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

RobHealthMan wrote:hi CS and others..

what are your thoughts on this? it goes against all i believe in terms of good health.

low carb, no beans, no soy, no veggie proteins...

this book looks like its written by a anti meat Dr. with an agenda.

thoughts??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

Read the criticism section of that wikipedia article for at least a partial answer to your question. The conclusions drawn by the author seem to be bogus.

RobHealthMan wrote:

thoughts??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Study

Animal-protein does increase free-IGF-1, which is known to downregulate SHBG (which prevents testosterone conversion), and stimulates tumor-growths. Free-IGF-1 also is able to stimulate androgen-syntheses. Dairy-proteins are a major inhibitor of IGFBP-3, which is absolutely vital for hair-regrowth, considering bald men have lower IGFBP-3 than non-balding men; dairy products are also shown to have DHT-precursors and potent estrogens (estrone, estradiol) in them as well! Numerous studies show that a high-fat diet (especially animal-fat) increases estrogen levels, which then can cause cancer in the breast or prostate, whereas a high-fiber diet binds estrogens in the digestive-track and promotes their excretion and increases SHBG. Also the protein in meat/dairy is so concentrated (acidic) that it pulls calcium from your bones to buffer the acid caused by the animal-protein, the result: bone-loss thru the urine with subsequent vitamin-D deficiency... plenty of studies to back this up as well.

I haven't read the study, but one thing comes to mind. What sort of meat were they consuming? Was it grass-fed, hormone and antibiotic-free meat? Or, was it the typical shit that you'd expect to buy in the store in China or America? My guess? The latter. And if that's the case, then there's your answer as to why those people were so unhealthy. Whoever concocted this study was seemingly looking to prove that high-protein is bad for you, and when you're looking to prove then you're already biased and it's not a scientific study. You'll overlook other contributing factors simply to prove your point to say "Hey, I'm right! Make me famous and give me money!"

nidhogge wrote:I haven't read the study, but one thing comes to mind. What sort of meat were they consuming? Was it grass-fed, hormone and antibiotic-free meat? Or, was it the typical shit that you'd expect to buy in the store in China or America? My guess? The latter. And if that's the case, then there's your answer as to why those people were so unhealthy. Whoever concocted this study was seemingly looking to prove that high-protein is bad for you, and when you're looking to prove then you're already biased and it's not a scientific study. You'll overlook other contributing factors simply to prove your point to say "Hey, I'm right! Make me famous and give me money!"

The study states that the people in rural-China eat only about 10% of their calories from protein and most of the protein is plant-based-protein, they eat about 10% of their calories from fat. These people don't have western-disease like breast-cancer, prostate-cancer, diabetes, heart-disease, osteoporosis, arthritis, acne, autoimmune-disorders, etc.

Dr. T Colin Campbell actually grew-up on a farm and claims that he always thought animal-protein was crucial for proper nutrition, but it wasn't until he conducted the study that he realized he was wrong and that most of these western-diseases were actually caused by a over consumption of animal-protein (and lack of fiber and phytonutrients).

Keeping this in mind, Dr.Caldwell Esselstyn has actually reversed heart-disease using the diet recommended in the China-study (legumes, whole-grains, fruit and vegetables). Dr.Dean Ornish has shown prostate-cancer can be stopped and reversed with the same diet. And don’t forget Dr.Neal Barnard who uses the same diet to reverse insulin-resistance and diabetes. These three diseases I just mention are shown to correlate with MPB!

The China study has been systematically debunked over and over and over again, it is probably one of the better examples of junk science you will ever see in your life. Mind you, I use the term "science" very loosely in this case.

Wasn't there just a thread dismantling the China study here not a few weeks ago...... the last time MisterE used it as reference?

That's all fine and dandy misterE, but there are plenty of civilizations that consume large amounts of animal protein and do not have any of those ailments as well. The difference is simply in the quality of the meat. Natural vs. Artificial. Man predominantly ate meat in his earlier years; we didn't always know how to farm, nor did we know right off the bat which veggies were edible and which were not. However, seeing animals kill one another for food is something that man would have seen right off the bat and gotten the idea to do the same for sustenance. Crude example, but my point is that meat protein is and always has been the main food of choice for humans. We are what we eat...eat an animal that grazes naturally, and you reap the same benefits. Eat an animal that is fed what it ought not to be fed and is loaded up with vaccines and other junk, then expect to reap the same detriments associated with that diet. It's elementary, really.

MisterE on being asked to show that there were any raw fooder/vegetarians found in nature:

There aren't any groups of people (yet) that are solely vegan, but it is clear that the less animal-products and processed-foods you eat, the better health you are in.

Guess Esselstyn knows better than nature.

Here's a few more good ones for good measure.

You are ignoring the elephant in the room: no one has ever reversed diabetes, heart-disease or prostate-enlargement on a high-fat/low-carb diet. Not one doctor, not even Dr. Atkins could show it could be done, however Dr. Esselstyn, Barnand and Ornish have.

OK...maybe he just has his information wrong. You cannot reverse diabetes on a high-fat/low-carb diet! It has never been done!

My favorite criticism of the book:

Campbell's admitted[4] search for validation of his pre-determined hypothesis has resulted in confirmation bias. "By not testing alternative hypotheses alongside his own, Campbell runs the risk of investigative tunnel vision, and cannot truly determine whether his hypothesis is more valid than another. ... [With over] 8,000 statistically significant correlations, [...] the China Study has generated enough material to bolster nearly any theory, regardless of actual validity—and for this reason, mandates an impartial and multi-perspective approach rather than a search for a predetermined outcome."[66]

Keeping the SHBG factor in check is very important, since it can prevent bioavailability of T. In general, the older you get, the more you want to keep a lid on SHBG and aromatase. Nettle root can accomplish this by binding to SHBG instead of T. Passionflower can keep a check on aromatase.

Raising SHBG while attempting to beat 5AR into submission is unlikely to yield a succesful outcome.

RobHealthman,

Check out this link, the author does a quite thorough analysis of the China Study, explaining why it's flawed science.

http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/08/06/final-china-study-response-html/

cpio wrote:Keeping the SHBG factor in check is very important, since it can prevent bioavailability of T. In general, the older you get, the more you want to keep a lid on SHBG and aromatase. Nettle root can accomplish this by binding to SHBG instead of T. Passionflower can keep a check on aromatase.

Raising SHBG while attempting to beat 5AR into submission is unlikely to yield a succesful outcome.

You do realize SHBG has a receptor don't you? Nettle root contains lignans that displace DHT from SHBG, thus increasing its metabolic-clearance-rate. SHBG binds excess estrogen to the scalp or prostate, which then causes subsequent accumulation of cAMP. Increasing SHBG will increase SHBG-bound-testosterone, which will then prevent SHBG from binding to the prostate or scalp and acting like an additional receptor.

Mistere, how do you debate Denise Mingers article that completing debunks the china study crap?

we all have to give mistere some credit, at least he's trying a vegan diet, i believe some people just need to experience it. it's only a matter of time before he fails miserably just like everyone else... just give it more time for his body to collapse.