No shampoo experiment. The result = rapid shedding

Just thought I'd throw this one out there for you fellas in case it may be of any help to you. I decided to go without washing my hair for 2 weeks, and, I can confirm, it causes baldness like you would not believe. First of all, my scalp has been chronically inflamed (all over), my hair line receded more, and the overall density of my hair has become very thin. Prior to this I had no inflammation probs and was even starting to gain some ground, but I am shocked at how much my hair has thinned and fallen out just by not washing.

So having witnessed much more than necessary I decide to finally wash my hair thoroughly. And guess what? The chronic inflammation, I have been suffering from for weeks, has now disappeared.

So what could the problem be? I can only imagine that going without washing is causing a bucket load of bacteria / fungus to build up inside the follicle wall and deposit inflammatory toxins, OR perhaps sebaceous acids. Whatever the situation is, going without washing has caused my hair to start falling out.

I washed my hair every day prior to my hairloss. I have gone long periods of time without washing my hair and the loss never sped nor slowed. Different for everyone.

I personally have had no problem with either. Some people really go at their scalp when they shampoo, this might be fine sometimes but my scalp tends to get dry from this. I tend just to wash the hair and not get into the scalp most of the time to avoid this.

Thats what happen when someone do something he/she does not understand at all. No poo = no shampoo, but you have to wash your scalp daily. Thats how I do. Every morning I wash my hair with warm water (remove sebum as good as shampoo) and then I rinse my whole head with cold water. No inflammation, no sebum, no hair loss.

On the other hand .. I notice inflammation when I do shampoo (without some moisturizing agent - like coconut oil or acv).

Now I can good without washing my hair at all few weeks and sebum buildup is little to no.

So what could the problem be? I can only imagine that going without washing is causing a bucket load of bacteria / fungus to build up inside the follicle wall and deposit inflammatory toxins, OR perhaps sebaceous acids. Whatever the situation is, going without washing has caused my hair to start falling out.

Edit : Ok, bacteria/fungus could be there. But healthy scalp would deal with it. This is the reason why NoPoo should help. It balances ph of your scalp, do not destroy the microenvironment and if its done properly it establishes healthy scalp environment.

Great videos. Get well soon!
p.s. how often do you shampoo and condition your hair?

Not very often, I've done all the "methods" over the years, now I settle on conditioning it with something moisturizing every week, when I cut it, I'll use shampoo, so I'd say shampoo twice a month, and condition 3 times a month. Do away with the everyday washing for sure, just rinse your hair with water.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rMeQb6RSVo

Watch the video please, do you think he suffers some bad inflammation ?

Same exact thing for me Xenon. I shampoo almost daily, and is an important part of my regimen. If my hair becomes too oily, the itch returns. Only other thing that brings my itch back is lots of wheat. Those two are hair killers for me personally.

I'm actually staggered by how much not washing the scalp can cause rapid baldness. There is a hormonal element to this, no doubt, in being that DHT causes the sebaceous glands to overproduce sebum. Sebum build up, within the follicle, must be breeding p.acnes or something because I've never suffered such terrible scalp irritation nor witnessed my hair start to fall out so fast. Don't get me wrong, I was aware of the inflammatory effects of not washing, but I just wanted to find out precisely what would happen if I continued. I got my answer, alright.

@lamka: At first I tried washing with some shampoo and cold water, this did not cause the inflammation to stop, so I tried again with some warm water and shampoo, the inflammation soon went away and has stayed away.  What could the difference be here? Perhaps warmer water causes hardened sebum to melt and dissolve from inside the follicle, whereas colder water keeps it in a solidified state.

I will try just using warm water without shampoo and see if this keeps the inflammation away, also. If the warm water, alone, does the trick, then it must be helping to dissolve sebum from the root.

And while I'm on this subject, my scalp has been laced with a shitload of sebum plugs since not washing.

There's no doubt in my mind, having witnessed this firsthand, sebum build up within the follicles can lead to rapid baldness.

Same.. I believe I lost more hair from not shampooing compared to anything else. However, if you do nofap, you will not feel the inflammation from not shampooing.

I know we have discussed the sebum issue in detail in the past, but I honestly never expected my hair to fall out so rapidly by not washing.

FWIW Here's something I found on another site:

"Ok I was at my GP not too long ago, an Egyptian doctor who I have been seeing for about a decade.

For the first time we spoke about my hair loss, well well fkn well.. what a surprise when that topic was brought up.

Turns out he used to work for Merck & Sharpe as a researcher back in Egypt and he was booted out for his theory on hair loss. This is no bull****.. this guy was a fkn knowledge machine. All this time!

DHT isn't the cause of hair loss is. Sebum is. This is why:

DHT triggers the glands in your follicle to overproduce sebum. Bacteria gathers in this overflow and your immune system then attacks the bacteria, INCLUDING the hair follicle with inflammation. He said it's very similar to the process of acne.

Propecia works by stopping the DHT triggering the sebum overflow. He said Propecia could make your hair worse if like me hyperandrogenicity causes the extra oil.

He said he proved this theory by putting an early stage patient on low dose accutane. He said the patient regrew hair. He said this is why Retinoid helps, not because it tackles DHT, but because it tackles the sebaceous gland and stops the production of sebum.. hence stopping the gathering of bacteria.. hence no inflammation and no immune response.

I also asked why some medications work and why some don't. He said in theory it should work for all, but there are 2 reasons it doesnt:

1. Internal drugs can cause hyperandrogenicity like I've experienced
2. Topical drugs don't reach the follicle BECAUSE of the sebum build up blocking it. He said minoxidil works best with retin-A not because retin-A helps hair loss through DHT, but helps the minoxidil flow down the follicle wall by eliminating sebum build up.

He said he never really gave it the years of research it deserves, but his theory is ultra-low-doses of Accutane stops hair loss. He said 10mg twice a week will do the job.

He said when he kept trying to push this idea through his experiments, Merck kicked him off the research team"

My guess is that if sebum is contributing to the inflammatory process, than by reducing the sebum build up in the scalp hair loss should be, at least, slowed down. I noticed that by the end of the day my forehead tends to get very shiny, consequently, my hairline itches. Lately, I´ve been washing my forehead and temples, at the end of the day, with some tea tree and green tea soap. I´ve tried in the past to only wash my hair with water and the result was an itchy scalp, frizzy hair, and I also suspect that I had some minor loss at my temples. These days I cant spend a day without washing my hair with some hot water and that tea tree soap.

Xenon wrote:Just thought I'd throw this one out there for you fellas in case it may be of any help to you. I decided to go without washing my hair for 2 weeks, and, I can confirm, it causes baldness like you would not believe. First of all, my scalp has been chronically inflamed (all over), my hair line receded more, and the overall density of my hair has become very thin. Prior to this I had no inflammation probs and was even starting to gain some ground, but I am shocked at how much my hair has thinned and fallen out just by not washing.

So having witnessed much more than necessary I decide to finally wash my hair thoroughly. And guess what? The chronic inflammation, I have been suffering from for weeks, has now disappeared.

So what could the problem be? I can only imagine that going without washing is causing a bucket load of bacteria / fungus to build up inside the follicle wall and deposit inflammatory toxins, OR perhaps sebaceous acids. Whatever the situation is, going without washing has caused my hair to start falling out.

blood test results ?

diet ?

supplements ?

shampoo being used , topicals ?

then we may be able to answer you

why does sebum not cause itchiness when nofap is there xenon?

blood test results ?

diet ?

supplements ?

shampoo being used , topicals ?

Never had bloods done.

Diet: mostly just a balance of complex carbs and proteins. I've eliminated grains / gluten as much as possible

No supplements

No specialized shampoos per se and no topicals

why does sebum not cause itchiness when nofap is there xenon?

I don't know, Sanderson, but I have just been reading something very interesting in regards to the pathology of acne and inflammation (which I believe has a similar pathology to MPB). It stated that there is a substance within sebum called squalene, and when it is oxidized and suffers free radical damage it turns into a biproduct called squalene peroxide. Squalene peroxide causes an inflammatory reaction.

Apparently, antioxidant topicals such as vit B3 can prevent squalene suffering from oxidative damage.

"Sebum is made of many fatty acids, one of them is called squalene. Squalene is very important for skin health and that’s why it’s part of many skincare formulations. However, it comes with a rather nasty downside.

When squalene suffers oxidative damage, it turns into squalene peroxide. Squalene peroxide is massively comedogenic. Animal studies have shown that applying squalene peroxide to rabbit ears causes acne in the area. And the severity of acne was linked to the degree of oxidative damage squalene suffered. In other words, if squalene only suffered minor damage it caused little bit of acne, but squalene that was badly damaged caused severe cystic acne.

Bacteria of course also play a role in acne. Once oxidative damage has blocked a pore and changed the environment within, the bacteria take over it and multiply rapidly. They produce toxins that irritate the skin. The immune system attacks the bacteria and this exponentially increases inflammation in the area. This is what turns invisible blocked pores into red and painful pimples.

But the important point is that none of this would happen without the initial oxidative damage to sebum. Let me say that one more time. Science has clearly shown there can be no acne without initial oxidative damage to sebum. It’s the match that lights the fire and sets the stage for acne.

That’s why most of your efforts should be aimed at preventing sebum oxidation. A case can also be made for antibacterial agents to control those pimples you cannot completely prevent – it happens because of genetics (say hi to your parents)."


http://www.acneeinstein.com/dont-know-how-to-get-over-acne-let-me-help/

I don't know how accurate all of the info is on that site, nor do I know if squalene peroxide is related to baldness but it sure is interesting to find out exactly why sebum causes so much inflammation when it builds up.

Why do people lose hair in a horse shoe pattern then ? Does sebum specifically accumulate there ?

and while the theory is nice, it's still missing massive parts. While this may trigger the inflammation cascade, it's not as simple as the body attacking hair follicles because of excess sebum. L'Oreal found excess collagen in the scalp of balding individuals. TGF-Beta which increases collagen deposit is one of the body's defense mechanisms. Retinol works in synergy with minox because it reduces collagen topically.

Plus why do animals don't get this problem and they never shampoo ? The excess sebum probably comes from an internal problem.

Elephanto wrote:Why do people lose hair in a horse shoe pattern then ? .

this article tries to answer the horse shoe pattern problem

http://www.dannyroddy.com/weblog/thebaldnessfield

however, there is no real specific reason why. the article is very vague

Accutane (isotretinoin) is poison. That can't be good for hair. Even in low dosage.

Is it possible that the quality rather than quantity of the sebum is an issue? I get a seborrhoeic dermatitis attack on my scalp about once every 3 months and I wonder if it's from a build up of bad fatty acids or whatever in the sebum from poor diet since I tend to eat good for a while and then I eat lots of bad foods. Still trying to figure out what triggers it.

I had a bad itch this morning, took two tocotrienols and it went away, could have just been a coincidence though.

Elephanto wrote:Why do people lose hair in a horse shoe pattern then ? Does sebum specifically accumulate there ?

and while the theory is nice, it's still missing massive parts. While this may trigger the inflammation cascade, it's not as simple as the body attacking hair follicles because of excess sebum. L'Oreal found excess collagen in the scalp of balding individuals. TGF-Beta which increases collagen deposit is one of the body's defense mechanisms. Retinol works in synergy with minox because it reduces collagen topically.

Plus why do animals don't get this problem and they never shampoo ? The excess sebum probably comes from an internal problem.

From what I understand, there is an excess production of sebum produced throughout the temples because of increased DHT receptors. Let's also not forget that sweat is heavily produced from the temples (again due to DHT receptors), so there might be a correlation with waste byproducts in sweat.

All I know is, not washing my scalp for a couple of weeks caused chronic inflammation and rapid shedding. And since washing again, all inflammation has completely stopped. That cannot be coincidence.

missymoo wrote:Is it possible that the quality rather than quantity of the sebum is an issue? I get a seborrhoeic dermatitis attack on my scalp about once every 3 months and I wonder if it's from a build up of bad fatty acids or whatever in the sebum from poor diet since I tend to eat good for a while and then I eat lots of bad foods. Still trying to figure out what triggers it.

I had a bad itch this morning, took two tocotrienols and it went away, could have just been a coincidence though.

It could be the quality of sebum, I just don't know exactly. I do tend to produce more sebum on my scalp than anywhere else on my body. For instance, my temples are generally always shiny and have a polished surface due to over production of sebum, yet if I wipe the skin with tissue, it has a matt appearance and I can see all of the pore openings, but about 5 minutes later the skin becomes shiny again.

As stated, it could be the quality of sebum, in being that it oxidizes and forms more inflammatory squalene peroxide, and perhaps fungi / bacterial mycotoxins, too.

What I found interesting concerning squalene peroxide is, it causes an increase in the IL-6 cytokine, which is known to cause hair to miniaturize.

Peroxidated squalene induces the production of inflammatory mediators in HaCaT keratinocytes: a possible role in acne vulgaris.
Ottaviani M1, Alestas T, Flori E, Mastrofrancesco A, Zouboulis CC, Picardo M.
Author information
Abstract
In order to investigate whether products derived from the oxidation of sebum can be responsible for the induction of inflammatory processes, HaCaT keratinocytes were treated with peroxidated squalene. NF-kappaB activation, secretion, and expression of IL-6, as well as peroxisome proliferator-activated receptor alpha (PPARalpha) mRNA and protein levels, were measured at the end of the treatment and after 24 and 48 hours of recovery. Squalene peroxidation products were administered in amounts able to elicit significant hyperproliferation and to induce lipoxygenase (LOX) activity. The results showed an early activation of NF-kappaB followed by an increase in PPARalpha mRNA and protein levels. Moreover, squalene peroxides induced an initial upregulation of IL-6 production and secretion that was counteracted by PPARalpha activation, as suggested by the subsequent decrease of NF-kappaB nuclear translocation and IL-6 levels. Inflammatory processes play an important role in the development of acne vulgaris. In combination with our own previous findings, which indicated an association between LOX stimulation and increased percentage of proinflammatory lipids in acne as well as a correlation between increased cytokine levels in the infundibulum, pilosebaceous duct hyperkeratinization, and augmented sebogenesis, the present data further support the involvement of lipid peroxides, in particular squalene peroxides, in establishing an inflammatory process in acne

And:

Dihydrotestosterone-inducible IL-6 inhibits elongation of human hair shafts by suppressing matrix cell proliferation and promotes regression of hair follicles in mice.

Kwack MH, Ahn JS, Kim MK, Kim JC, Sung YK.
Source
Department of Immunology, Kyungpook National University School of Medicine, Daegu, Korea.

Abstract
Autocrine and paracrine factors are produced by balding dermal papilla (DP) cells following dihydrotestosterone (DHT)-driven alterations and are believed to be key factors involved in male pattern baldness. Herein we report that the IL-6 is upregulated in balding DP cells compared with non-balding DP cells. IL-6 was upregulated 3? hours after 10-100 ?nM DHT treatment, and ELISA showed that IL-6 was secreted from balding DP cells in response to DHT. IL-6 receptor (IL-6R) and glycoprotein 130 (gp130) were expressed in follicular keratinocytes, including matrix cells. Recombinant human IL-6 (rhIL-6) inhibited hair shaft elongation and suppressed proliferation of matrix cells in cultured human hair follicles. Moreover, rhIL-6 injection into the hypodermis of mice during anagen caused premature onset of catagen. Taken together, our data strongly suggest that DHT-inducible IL-6 inhibits hair growth as a paracrine mediator from the DP.
--------------------

TheDivineMarquis wrote:My guess is that if sebum is contributing to the inflammatory process, than by reducing the sebum build up in the scalp hair loss should be, at least, slowed down. I noticed that by the end of the day my forehead tends to get very shiny, consequently, my hairline itches. Lately, I´ve been washing my forehead and temples, at the end of the day, with some tea tree and green tea soap. I´ve tried in the past to only wash my hair with water and the result was an itchy scalp, frizzy hair, and I also suspect that I had some minor loss at my temples. These days I cant spend a day without washing my hair with some hot water and that tea tree soap.

I missed this post, but I thought I'd comment and update on my situation. First of all, I have been thoroughly washing with shampoo twice per day and I'm experiencing some mild inflammation mainly around my hair line. This must be from certain chemicals within the shampoo (perhaps SLS), so I am going to have to switch to a more natural product (maybe tea tree soap or something). I might even just try washing with some warm water twice per day and see how that helps.

On one level, shampoo is helpful for dissolving grease from follicles, but the downside is the chemical irritants they contain.  I remember experimenting with some shampoo on my wrist; I lathered some into my skin and left it on, and, about fifteen minutes later, the skin begin to inflame. When I rinsed it off, the inflammation subsided, but a few days after the skin began to peel. Therefore I can only conclude that *over washing* with shampoo can leave chemical residue inside the follicle and inflame it.

Edited:

Inflammatory response to sodium lauryl sulfate in aqueous solutions applied to the skin of normal human volunteers.
Novak E, Francom SF.
Abstract
In this double-blind study, the intensity and duration of the inflammatory response induced by various concentrations of sodium lauryl sulfate (SLS) solution on the forearms of 36 normal male volunteers was dependent upon the concentration and number of applications of SLS. One 24-h application of the 4% or 5% aqueous SLS solution or two successive 24-h applications of the 2% or 3% SLS solutions were sufficient to cause an inflammatory response in the epidermis. Such response makes the skin more permeable for the testing of topical formulations of compounds to document their propensity to irritate

And:

Abstract
Objective and design
Sodium lauryl sulfate (SLS) is a known irritant. It releases pro-inflammatory mediators considered pivotal in inflammatory pain. The sensory effects of SLS in the skin remain largely unexplored. In this study, SLS was evaluated for its effect on skin sensory functions.
Subjects
Eight healthy subjects were recruited for this study.
Treatment
Skin sites were randomized to topical SLS 0.25, 0.5, 1, 2% and vehicle for 24 h. Topical capsaicin 1% was applied for 30 min at 24 h after SLS application.
Methods
Assessments included laser Doppler imaging of local vasodilation and flare reactions, rating of spontaneous pain, assessment of primary thermal and tactile hyperalgesia, and determination of secondary dynamic and static hyperalgesia.
Results
SLS induced significant and dose-dependent local inflammation and primary hyperalgesia to tactile and thermal stimulation at 24 h after application, with SLS 2% treatment eliciting results comparable to those observed following treatment with capsaicin 1%. SLS induced no spontaneous pain, small areas of flare, and minimal secondary hyperalgesia. The primary hyperalgesia vanished within 2–3 days, whereas the skin inflammation persisted and was only partly normalized by Day 6.
Conclusions
SLS induces profound perturbations of skin sensory functions lasting 2–3 days. SLS-induced inflammation may be a useful model for studying the mechanisms of inflammatory pain.

Great find on those studies, I do believe most shampoos do more damage than good. White vinegar and coconut oil seems like the best option to wash your hair. I used to do the apple vinegar cider but that stuff is full of bacteria so I won't take chances. White vinegar is refined and will still provide the benefits of decalcification, as for coconut oil, it is anti-microbial.

Xenon wrote:What I found interesting concerning squalene peroxide is, it causes an increase in the IL-6 cytokine, which is known to cause hair to miniaturize.

Here is another interesting study about IL6 and androgen receptor in prostate cancer:

Interleukin-6 induces androgen responsiveness in prostate cancer cells through up-regulation of androgen receptor expression.
Lin DL1, Whitney MC, Yao Z, Keller ET.
Author information
Abstract
Interleukin-6 (IL-6) induces prostate cancer (CaP) cell proliferation in vitro. Several lines of evidence suggest that IL-6 may promote CaP progression through induction of an androgen response. In this work, we explored whether IL-6 induces androgen responsiveness through modulation of androgen receptor (AR) expression. We found that in the absence of androgen, IL-6 increased prostate-specific antigen (PSA) mRNA levels and activated several androgen-responsive promoters, but not the non-androgen responsive promoters in LNCaP cells. Bicalutamide, an antiandrogen, abolished the IL-6 effect and IL-6 could not activate the PSA and murine mammary tumor virus reporters in AR-negative DU-145 and PC3 cells. These data indicate the IL-6 induces an androgen response in CaP cells through the AR. Pretreatment of LNCaP cells with SB202190, PD98059, or tyrphostin AG879 [p38 mitogen-activated protein kinase (MAPK), MAP/extracellular signal-regulated protein kinase kinase 1/2, and ErbB2 MAPK inhibitors, respectively) but not wortmannin (PI3-kinase inhibitor) blocked IL-6-mediated induction of the PSA promoter, which demonstrates that IL-6 activity is dependent on a MAPK pathway. Finally, IL-6 activated the AR gene promoter, resulting in increased AR mRNA and protein levels in LNCaP cells. These results demonstrate that IL-6 induces AR expression and are the first report of cytokine-mediated induction of the AR promoter. Taken together, our results suggest that IL-6 induces AR activity through both increasing AR gene expression and activating the AR in the absence of androgen in CaP cells. These results provide a mechanism through which IL-6 may contribute to the development of androgen-independent CaP.