Best supps for anxiety and depression

IH,

My sister was recently diagnosed with this. She would have panic attacks that included chest pains/numbness, etc. They checked out her out and told her she is suffering from anxiety and depression.

What would be the best course of supplements to help support her through this. Maybe stuff that can help deal with the physical manifestations of her panic attacks while she's working on the psychological?

I know you had mentioned Lithium Orotate and I still have that from when I was making the topical? Would/could that help? Any idea on dosage?

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

hadrion - For acute anxiety, 750 mg of GABA (Gamma-aminobutyric acid) is very useful.

This product has a nice combo of items for anxiety:

http://www.iherb.com/MRM-Relax-All-with-Phenibut-60-Capsules/4842?at=0

Lithium orotate may help a little too. I noticed that Doctor's best now offers an inexpensive version of their own.

hadrion - For general support, if she were to take high dose vitamin D, fish oil, and magnesium, her anxiety will probably vanish in a few months.

CausticSymmetry wrote:hadrion - For general support, if she were to take high dose vitamin D, fish oil, and magnesium, her anxiety will probably vanish in a few months.

I agree completely. My anxiety has lessened greatly with this plus iodine

Hadrion,

This stuff is good: http://www.iherb.com/Now-Foods-True-Calm-90-Capsules/841?at=0

Many things are useful:

*magnesium
*vitamin C
*ashwagandha
*l-theanine
*lithium orotate
*TMG
*vitamin d
*kava kava
*sam-e
*phosphatidylserine
*b6
*taurine
*chamomile
*licorice
*passionflower
*rhodiola
*omega-3's

The list is long!

I forgot tryptophan or 5-htp

Thanks so much for this guys. She has 3 kids and her husband lost his job and she started complaining of chest pains and numbness in the left side of her face (cheek area). She's been checked out thoroughly and they diagnosed it as anxiety/depression/panic attacks, so I want to try to get her on the right supplements to support her internally since she has clearly some work to do to get through this.

The physical manifestations of the panic attacks have to be dealt with since they mimc other emergency health issues.

What a mess.

hadrion wrote:Thanks so much for this guys. She has 3 kids and her husband lost his job and she started complaining of chest pains and numbness in the left side of her face (cheek area). She's been checked out thoroughly and they diagnosed it as anxiety/depression/panic attacks, so I want to try to get her on the right supplements to support her internally since she has clearly some work to do to get through this.

The physical manifestations of the panic attacks have to be dealt with since they mimc other emergency health issues.

What a mess.

Hadrion,

Whatever you do man, please do not let them give her a benzodiazepine! Those are the drugs like valium, xanax, klonopin, etc. They are absolute poison and can ruin your life! They hand them out like candy to people with stress or anxiety. They are extremely addicting and harder to come off than heroin. You can actually die if you stop cold turkey. Just want to make sure no-one else false prey to them unexpectedly. Thanks

Paradox,

They gave her Xanax. She started taking it earlier this week.

Thank God my Mom took the advice I got for her in this forum and got off prescription cholesterol drugs and saw a huge improvement. Because of that, she told my sister to talk to me about this because the prescription stuff they hand of for her issue is deadly.

It obviously got through to her for her to tell me about this and see what I could find out. Luckily, most of the supplements you guys mentioned I already have in my arsenal so I can give them to her to get started on.

That product you linked to on iherb looks interesting and I'm going to order her some of that.

I really had no idea that panic attacks could really mimic heart attack/stroke symptoms.

It just gets back to my theory that a lot of health issues are brought on by stress and psychological issues we go through.

Hadrion,

Damn, I knew they would be handing benzos out to her. Fortunately it isn't too late, but you absolutely need to get her off the benzodiazepines as soon as possible!

This is what someone in cold turkey benzo withdrawal looks like 4 MONTHS after stopping the drug. Have her watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDbPnAQ-c1o[/url]

Here is a great video about Xanax addiction:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEIg1as2ppc&feature=fvw


They will seriously ruin her life, and I am not overstating that. I am not really against all forms of psychotropic medications, but the benzodiazepines are the single worst class of drugs I have ever come across in my life. Much worse than opiate addiction. When you discontinue the drugs, you experience what can only be described as hell! Sometimes the damage is irreversible. You owe it to her to pass on this info. I wouldn't wish these drugs on my worst enemy. Please read this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benzodiazepine_withdrawal_syndrome

There is an entire community of people who have had their life's destroyed: http://benzowithdrawal.com/forum/index.php and
http://www.benzobuddies.org/#benzodiazepine-withdrawal-support

Here is a great book on benzo withdrawal (video) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PEMsZ_8Fvk[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDbPnAQ-c1o

Plain GABA may not cross BBB - you can try for yourself, it did nothing for me. I tried the PharmaGABA which apparently is the fermented version - that does a little bit, but you need to take quite a few for it to have any effect.

Interestingly from Russia comes a product called "Picamilon" - it is GABA bound to Niacin and passes thru BBB like NSA agents in a security line. Try that, it is the best I understand. Both Niacin and GABA are good for anxiety...abd Picamilon has the correct form in it.

Valerian & Taurine helps too. It the HPT axis is messed up, it could be cortisol/adrenaline related in which case herbs/supps to calm down the HPT axis would help - Holy Basil and PS comes to mind there.

Generally you should try to figure out what is the underlying cause of anxiety for a long term solution. Could it be diet, stress, toxins - why is the excitatory pathway taking over the brain? Could there be glutamate or MSG related trigger?

Oh BTW the previous post was just for anxiety - for depression you should look into balancing neurotransmitters by perhaps supporting methylation: Sam-e, p5p, active B12, active Folate. This is where master neurotransmitters are created so helping the methylation cycle can bring them back to normalcy.

You may want to consider neuroscience neurotransmitter testing via urine to figure out which area to look into - in the absence of such info, supporting methylation is perhaps prudent.

Gut+Liver+Adrenals+Thyroid are the key organs somehow look into taking care of these organs - generally the rest of the health should self correct. For anxiety/depression perhaps Liver is the most important place to look into for general long term support...

lund wrote:Oh BTW the previous post was just for anxiety - for depression you should look into balancing neurotransmitters by perhaps supporting methylation: Sam-e, p5p, active B12, active Folate. This is where master neurotransmitters are created so helping the methylation cycle can bring them back to normalcy.

You may want to consider neuroscience neurotransmitter testing via urine to figure out which area to look into - in the absence of such info, supporting methylation is perhaps prudent.

Gut+Liver+Adrenals+Thyroid are the key organs somehow look into taking care of these organs - generally the rest of the health should self correct. For anxiety/depression perhaps Liver is the most important place to look into for general long term support...

Awesome post Lund! That is seriously the most helpful post I have seen in a while, and I agree completely. I would suggest adrenal cortisol levels be checked via 24 hour saliva testing to rule out adrenal fatigue. Like you said, if adrenal fatigue is an issue then certain herbs and supplements will help. The methylation part is often missed as well, so I'm glad you brought it up. Unfortunately that one requires testing as well to determine if one is an under/over-methylator. Some supplements like folate are good if you are an overmethylator, and detrimental if you are an undermethylator. Undermethylators on the other hand respond well to SAM-e. I just wanted to clarify that all those things may not necessarily be taken together depending on one's methylation.

Another thing that can cause anxiety is sex hormone balance- estrogen/test ratio in both men and women. Supplements for this would be specific as well.

Then there is thyroid which requires testing. Bottom line is get lab work done I guess.

For sexual related anxiety, stress or neurosis, damiana is King .. or Queen if you like.

Does anyone have any good ways to support liver?

North-Europe wrote:For sexual related anxiety, stress or neurosis, damiana is King .. or Queen if you like.

Do you ever smoke it?

CS, you mentioned earlier;

"vitamin D, fish oil, and magnesium"

Would help cure anxiety in a few months, to what dosages, roughly, would you suggest of these? Is standard supermarkets fish oil and magnesium (magnesium oxide I think) good enough?

No supplement can replace the importance of exercise I truly believe. Cardio and resistance training. Its commonly "prescribed" for psychiatric pasients.

Paradox wrote:

lund wrote:Oh BTW the previous post was just for anxiety - for depression you should look into balancing neurotransmitters by perhaps supporting methylation: Sam-e, p5p, active B12, active Folate. This is where master neurotransmitters are created so helping the methylation cycle can bring them back to normalcy.

You may want to consider neuroscience neurotransmitter testing via urine to figure out which area to look into - in the absence of such info, supporting methylation is perhaps prudent.

Gut+Liver+Adrenals+Thyroid are the key organs somehow look into taking care of these organs - generally the rest of the health should self correct. For anxiety/depression perhaps Liver is the most important place to look into for general long term support...

Awesome post Lund! That is seriously the most helpful post I have seen in a while, and I agree completely. I would suggest adrenal cortisol levels be checked via 24 hour saliva testing to rule out adrenal fatigue. Like you said, if adrenal fatigue is an issue then certain herbs and supplements will help. The methylation part is often missed as well, so I'm glad you brought it up. Unfortunately that one requires testing as well to determine if one is an under/over-methylator. Some supplements like folate are good if you are an overmethylator, and detrimental if you are an undermethylator. Undermethylators on the other hand respond well to SAM-e. I just wanted to clarify that all those things may not necessarily be taken together depending on one's methylation.

Another thing that can cause anxiety is sex hormone balance- estrogen/test ratio in both men and women. Supplements for this would be specific as well.

Then there is thyroid which requires testing. Bottom line is get lab work done I guess.

Just FYI, theories explaining mental illness with an imbalance in biochemical processes are not supported by evidence (Valenstein 1998; US Department of Health and Human Services, 1999; Glenmullen 2000).

From Whitaker's Anatomy of an Epidemic:

Yet a societal belief in chemical imbalances has remained (for reasons that will be explored later), and it has led those who have investigated and written about this history to emphasize, time and again, the same bottom-line conclusion: "The evidence does not support any of the biochemical theories of mental illness," concluded Elliott Valenstein, a professor of neuroscience at the University of Michigan, in his 1998 book Blaming the Brain. Even U.S. surgeon general David Satcher, in his 1999 report Mental Health, confessed that "the precise causes [etiologies] of mental disorders are not known." In Prozac Backlash, Joseph Glenmullen, an instructor of psychiatry at Harvard Medical School, noted that "in every instance where such an imbalance was thought to be found, it was later proved to be false." Finally, in 2005, Kenneth Kendler, coeditor in chief of Psychological Medicine, penned an admirably succinct epitaph for this whole story: "We have hunted for big simple neurochemical explanations for psychiatric disorders and have not found them."

Thus, alternative and mainstream psychiatric medicines do not work to fix any neurochemical "imbalance," as none exists. The theory is baseless. Of course, it does not mean that these methods have no effect upon the brain. Psychiatric medicines create abnormalities in the brain's synapses which lessen symptoms of various illnesses - for a time. And, again, all of this is not to say that neither alternative nor psychiatric medicines do not work. They just may not do you any good in the long term.

Benzodiazepines reportedly work well in the short term, but do little for symptoms in the long term. They probably even aggravate them. In brief, benzodiazepines (let's shorten it to BZP) affect the function of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) in the brain. GABA works in an opposite manner to dopamine and serotonin, which are excitatory in nature; GABA is inhibitory. BZP binds to GABA and "amplifies GABA's inhibitory effects." (Whitaker) The first week or so of BZP treatment shows good results for lessening the symptoms of anxiety, however, just like in the case of neuroleptic drugs such as chlorpromazine (Thorazine), the brain is pretty good at adapting to an alteration of neurotransmitter function through compensation. In the case of GABA, output of the neurotransmitter is reduced and, perhaps concomitantly, the density of GABA receptors decreases. This is the likely explanation for the absolute mess that occurs after someone goes off benzodiazepines. BZPs puts the accelerator on the whole GABA system and the brain compensates by lessening its presence in the brain. When that BZP accelerator is gone (going off the drug), the GABA system has been effectively impaired, leading to an impairment of the brain's ability to inhibit neuronal activity.

What to do?
1. I'd avoid BZPs because a. the underlying theory for these drugs has little support in evidence and a. the long-term effects of BZPs may completely break the GABA system in a way that the brain cannot return to normal.

[Disclaimer to the above: your sister appears to be suffering from acute and severe attacks of anxiety. You must understand that whoever prescribed BZPs wanted to provide quick relief to her symptoms. If the symptoms were debilitating, i.e. led to a total cease of everyday functioning, it's hard to fault this prescription. Just be aware of the long-term problems that may occur.]

2. In a similar fashion, I'd avoid alternative methods that purportedly target "neurochemical imbalance" as the underlying theory has no basis. If these methods are just generally good for your health, that's a different story (try to pick apart their claims vs. what the methods actually do)

3. NrwgnKID suggested regular exercise. I agree, however it may be very difficult for your sister to do this given her situation. You need to stress the importance of exercise in general mental and physical health. See if you can go on runs or walks with her daily. She may need help with this.

4. Have her go to a psychologist that specializes in anxiety/depression and have her tell the psychologist that she wants therapy and not drugs. She needs to target the underlying causes of her anxiety and depression that she has an effect on. The psychologist will help her with this. Make sure that, if she doesn't like the psychologist in any way, she goes to a different one. Creating a solid bond here is important.

Your sister needs more than just supplements and medicine. She needs support as well. A therapist can help her with this, and you know what else? You can help her with this too. Make sure she's aware that she's not alone.

I was going to order some d-biotin, magnesium and brewers yeast, the brands that IH uses in his regimen. I saw these were some part of an "adrenal repair" guide on a website, hoping to calm my anxiety as well.

Would some of the products mentioned in this thread, such as MRM or True Calm be better?

Rhodiola seems popular on Earth Clinic for curing anxiety. Does anyone know if affects cortisol at all? As I haven't had my cortisol tested yet I don't want to lower or higher it in the wrong direction, but need to take a supp to help anxiety soon.

Ashwagandha on CS' regimen seems like it could be used to help anxiety. Does anyone have any experience with either of these in regards to curing anxiety?

Also planning on getting ACV, magnesium and brewers yeast.

Not 100% sure but in your age and on this forum you probably have high cortisol level. I am in your age group (17) I have cortisol level elevated.

I have been using ashwagandha for 3 months or so and I like it, although it won't fully solve problem. It's important to choose good brand, I was using this herb from my local pharma and it was the way better than Swanson's one I am using currently. Also highly recommend holy basil, magnesium (chloride), vit C. Rhodiola seems also very good, but no personal experience yet. Next week I am gonna start my driving lessons so i will probabbly need another big order of these stuffs :-D

Hey Quisque, cheers for the reply.

Yeah, I guessed I had high cortisol, but don't want to lower it, just incase I have low cortisol or something. Have you had your cortisol tested?

I'm planning to buy the mixed forms magnesium and the ashwagandha, both the sorts on IH's Ancillary section of regimen, so I reckon they're good quality.

Haha, yeah I'm having driving lessons at the moment, I know how you feel.

Are ashwaghanda and rhodiola adaptogens? Does that mean they help balance rather than lower or higher specifically, like licorice and holy basil?

Out of ashwaghanda, rhodiola and holy basil which is more effective?

Do I need to "cycle" all three (when taken individually)