Detumesance Therapy And Scalp Ridge

Hairy Potter wrote:
Great answer - thank you! One more question: In your opinion, what are the chances that very small vellus hairs can become terminal again, once O2 levels are at least elevated (if not completely restored), by DT.

What I mean is, it looks like it is possible for vellus to become terminal again, because we've seen that happening with Drex's sides, but one would need to keep on doing DT until the systemic problem is rectified surely, whereas, the DT study seems to think that 10 months is enough. Personally, I don't see how that is possible?

It takes 10 months of massage and once that has been effective the body will be supplying more blood, more oxygen
and better lymph drainage and then the hair will continue to grow without assistance.

Why didn't that happen before? Why was there a break down in the process at all? That is the question.

egodust wrote:

Hairy Potter wrote:
Great answer - thank you! One more question: In your opinion, what are the chances that very small vellus hairs can become terminal again, once O2 levels are at least elevated (if not completely restored), by DT.

What I mean is, it looks like it is possible for vellus to become terminal again, because we've seen that happening with Drex's sides, but one would need to keep on doing DT until the systemic problem is rectified surely, whereas, the DT study seems to think that 10 months is enough. Personally, I don't see how that is possible?

It takes 10 months of massage and once that has been effective the body will be supplying more blood, more oxygen
and better lymph drainage and then the hair will continue to grow without assistance.

Why didn't that happen before? Why was there a break down in the process at all? That is the question.

That answer excites me! Sorry for all the questions brother, but why 10 months? And how will the body be able to continue without assistance if it wasn't able to before (similar to your question of why did the breakdown happen in the first place)?

Hairy Potter wrote:
That answer excites me! Sorry for all the questions brother, but why 10 months? And how will the body be able to continue without assistance if it wasn't able to before (similar to your question of why did the breakdown happen in the first place)?

For me personally a huge amount of stress which was out of the ordinary started the problem for me, the enzymes
implicated in MBP cause other problems too (such as heart disease, high blood pressure, etc) so even if we help the
scalp we are in a state of poor health and need to fix the underlying causes.

I would not get hung up on the 10 month thing, only some parts of my scalp are unhealthy, I can feel them, because
this state is newer for me than someone who had MBP start a younger age I know where the problem areas are and
hence DT is easier to manage.

The fact DT works at all is amazing, the main problem is that once hair loss has started it affects stress levels which
end up in a vicious cycle - DT helps break that cycle which reduces stress which affects the whole body, esp the thyroid.

egodust wrote:

Hairy Potter wrote:
That answer excites me! Sorry for all the questions brother, but why 10 months? And how will the body be able to continue without assistance if it wasn't able to before (similar to your question of why did the breakdown happen in the first place)?

For me personally a huge amount of stress which was out of the ordinary started the problem for me, the enzymes
implicated in MBP cause other problems too (such as heart disease, high blood pressure, etc) so even if we help the
scalp we are in a state of poor health and need to fix the underlying causes.

I would not get hung up on the 10 month thing, only some parts of my scalp are unhealthy, I can feel them, because
this state is newer for me than someone who had MBP start a younger age I know where the problem areas are and
hence DT is easier to manage.

The fact DT works at all is amazing, the main problem is that once hair loss has started it affects stress levels which
end up in a vicious cycle - DT helps break that cycle which reduces stress which affects the whole body, esp the thyroid.

Make sense - thanks a lot man   

egodust wrote:

Hairy Potter wrote:
Thanks for this Egodust - so, I'm interested to know whether you are a proponent of the tight scalp theory, i.e. that baldness is caused by a tight scalp?

It looks like you are saying calcium dominance, as you say, is the cause of a tight scalp, which is the cause of atrophying capillary networks and bloodflow in the scalp, which is the cause of DHT buildup in the scalp, which causes baldness. Am I correct?

There is no build up of DHT - the DHT in the scalp that is produced is by conversion because 5ar activity is
possible due to LOW oxygen levels

DHT and calcium are linked, where DHT is present then calcium will follow, this is NOT a bad thing by itself!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19701831

Dihydrotestosterone treatment increased L-type calcium current density by the upregulation of Ca(V)1.2 in human ventricular myocytes. These data provide a possible explanation for dihydrotestosterone effects on the cardiovascular system in androgenic steroid abuse

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2492887

Castrated control animals maintained for 11 days after implantation of bone matrix showed significantly lower calcium levels in the induced implant than was observed earlier in the unoperated controls

So of course the muscle is tight, there is too much calcium, there HAS to be, because there is too much DHT
and that is due to level of minerals and systemic inflammation.

1) CRP levels are high due to low vitamin C ... vitamin C stops the uptake of calcium too
2) DHT is too high due to poor mineral balances (esp Zinc)
3) NO levels are low due to poor vitamin C status, higher blood pressure, etc
4) Vitamin D is low

But when you do DT, you change the calcium status and the oxygen status and hence lower DHT, studies have
shown that just applying a placebo topical will reduce DHT levels in the scalp by 13%!

So now consider that heavy massage will get rid of calcium and DHT (due to better oxygenation) and you can see
why regrowth is possible for many guys.

If you look at the body of research on MBP, you'll see:

1) minerals are implicated
2) hormones are implicated
3) immune system is implicated

So getting rid of the tightness is one thing, getting rid of the reason the tightness is created is another problem.

This is a SPECTACULAR answer! When did your hair loss problem start btw? Mine started about 2- 2 1/2 years who after one of the most stressful years of my life. I was binge drinking, getting fat, depressed because of the weight I was gaining, and more. Glad I'm starting fresh and reversing everything though!

Your post makes me look at the diet aspect of this whole problem a lot more. I've always known manuals could take care of mostly everything on it's own... However, it does make sense to tackle the thing that started this whole thing. After all, having a good diet is optimal for living a great, long life either way!

I've just had a look through this thread - thought I'd clear up a few things

At no point did I mean that the ridge is bone. That would be idiotic beyond belief. I can push it down and massage it away. That's not bone.

My original post made that pretty darn clear. Anyone who thinks this is to do with excess bone or massaging is changing it that fast needs to sit down and really think that through. Go through the success threads here - there is NO evidence or plausible medical explanation for skull shape changing.

Next thing - the vast majority of people here need only take care of themselves and follow the IH6 for basic health.

Your hairloss is unlikely to be cured by eliminating some parasite or imbalance or giving up wheat. For a few it works - but you won't find tons of success stories.

Over the years manual methods seem to have come on a lot - and there are going to be other methods that work well. I think it's worth accepting though - that there is a lot of hypochondria from people. It's understandable given the stress this causes but there is no need to muddy the waters on what is working.

There are a lot of good guys here who post and share more than they need to.

Then there are people who like to add in their belief that a chakra imbalance / water fluoridation / something else might regrow hair.

I can't say this strongly enough - manuals work. There are so many people posting. If you don't believe - that's fine - but you don't need to muddy the waters with whats already been covered. It really slows down progress.

For instance - people saying this could be calcification and talking about David Wolfe.

I know it's easy to get distracted and suffer from information overload - but come on!

Get results with manuals first - then try the other stuff. Or go prove what you're thinking and come back. Otherwise you are wasting your time. I say this because there are members here still chasing the next miracle detox, the next food to eliminate - and not making any progress.

Literally - one guy - he was completely random and a hypochondriac. Jumped in every thread to criticise people with results. Guess what - he's still here, made zero progress.

A little logic, research and planning can go a long way.

The calcification comments illustrate this. Think about it - what does lymphomema damage do? Yup - calcification - but your not going to find answers in David's coffee / coco bean therapy.

If you think so - go and try it - then and only then comment - until then it's only speculation. Even worse, it's speculation that lacks proof, anecdotal evidence, logic and is clearly not thought through.

So how am I doing with something that works?

Overall - I'm starting to see a very regular cycle of invisible vellus - long vellus - frosted hair - shed - thin hair. It takes about two weeks to go through this cycle - and I believe I'm seeing an acceleration of growth.

It's taken me a few years of the margo method to get my hairline growing again. Looking at photos - I have a better hairline now than I did in 2011. For me, that's a miracle.

My diffuse thinning can be covered up to an extent - but its obvious I don't have the thickest hair around.

Now it looks as if detumesance therapy will grow that back - the growth since I last posted is already visible!

I expect to be a solid NW3 or 2.5 this time next year with good coverage.

Complexx wrote:[
This is a SPECTACULAR answer! When did your hair loss problem start btw? Mine started about 2- 2 1/2 years who after one of the most stressful years of my life. I was binge drinking, getting fat, depressed because of the weight I was gaining, and more. Glad I'm starting fresh and reversing everything though!

Your post makes me look at the diet aspect of this whole problem a lot more. I've always known manuals could take care of mostly everything on it's own... However, it does make sense to tackle the thing that started this whole thing. After all, having a good diet is optimal for living a great, long life either way!

My mother died, I moved into a new place with lots of mold - before my hair loss started I had all these scalp changes
and so I started with manuals, at the time I didn't know they were, the only topical I was using was Ionic Zinc as
that helped with the burning.

Because I lost sensation in the scalp and by that I mean, I felt bald even though I had hair, I couldn't feel the hair
and it felt alien, I had to keep touching it to remind myself it was there - that feeling was gone and then I knew
I was in trouble already.

Squeezing and pinching showed that I had some kinda build up, I managed to squeeze one and a pus/ooze
sensation occurred!

After that I started on bromelain and that really helped with the itching/burning and then finally I found MSM
really cooled down the whole area.

That was mid 2013, I have since grown back a lot of the crown area and the temples, but my hair has suffered
a lot and isn't fixed.

Doing manuals and controlling for inflammation saved my hair, now I have back the feeling of hair, the coolness
and it feels much more like it did before I started losing hair.

egodust wrote:

Complexx wrote:[
This is a SPECTACULAR answer! When did your hair loss problem start btw? Mine started about 2- 2 1/2 years who after one of the most stressful years of my life. I was binge drinking, getting fat, depressed because of the weight I was gaining, and more. Glad I'm starting fresh and reversing everything though!

Your post makes me look at the diet aspect of this whole problem a lot more. I've always known manuals could take care of mostly everything on it's own... However, it does make sense to tackle the thing that started this whole thing. After all, having a good diet is optimal for living a great, long life either way!

My mother died, I moved into a new place with lots of mold - before my hair loss started I had all these scalp changes
and so I started with manuals, at the time I didn't know they were, the only topical I was using was Ionic Zinc as
that helped with the burning.

Because I lost sensation in the scalp and by that I mean, I felt bald even though I had hair, I couldn't feel the hair
and it felt alien, I had to keep touching it to remind myself it was there - that feeling was gone and then I knew
I was in trouble already.

Squeezing and pinching showed that I had some kinda build up, I managed to squeeze one and a pus/ooze
sensation occurred!

After that I started on bromelain and that really helped with the itching/burning and then finally I found MSM
really cooled down the whole area.

That was mid 2013, I have since grown back a lot of the crown area and the temples, but my hair has suffered
a lot and isn't fixed.

Doing manuals and controlling for inflammation saved my hair, now I have back the feeling of hair, the coolness
and it feels much more like it did before I started losing hair.

Sorry to hear about the loss of your Mom man, that sucks in a big way.

I wish I had been doing 10-15 years ago what I'm doing now. I can relate to the alien hair thing very well. When you mention MSM, are you talking topical or internal. Right now I'm taking 10g internal and will slowly increase to 20g (I was doing 20 before but then moved house and had to drop back down because I stopped for awhile).

It seems like a good combo with DT would be K2, D3 and mag oil for the calcification thing - what do you reckon? I'm trying to get the balance right at the moment of the things that I'm taking, without becoming overly concerned about doing exactly the right thing if you know what I mean.

Been taking iodine (9 drops - don't know what that amounts to in mg), MSM (10g), Zinc picolinate (±44mg), magnesium chloride (400 - 500mg), vit C (1-2g), and a bit of biotin and multi-B. Oh yes, and foti. So I've been having some mildish 'healing responses'.

I think I read once that CS posted that the 4 main things needed were iodine, zinc, magnesium and something else (selenium, or iron, or...)?

I agree with some of what GBP said about just focusing on what works (manuals) - but if we're dealing with calcification, why not take stuff internally that helps with that too right? Just feeling my way here - nutrition is definitely not my area of knowledge :-)

Hairy Potter wrote:
I agree with some of what GBP said about just focusing on what works (manuals) - but if we're dealing with calcification, why not take stuff internally that helps with that too right? Just feeling my way here - nutrition is definitely not my area of knowledge :-)

I get my K2 from chicken, I have started taking more K2 recently and Biotin as well - I take MSM internally (2g/3g) a day
with nascent iodine and selenium (helps with uptake).

I still do manuals as well, light massage most often and heavy massage when I feel I need it if the tightness occurs
which it hasn't done for ages.

The reason why MSM helps btw, it reduces calcium phosphate

gbp2000 wrote:I've just had a look through this thread - thought I'd clear up a few things

At no point did I mean that the ridge is bone. That would be idiotic beyond belief. I can push it down and massage it away. That's not bone.

My original post made that pretty darn clear. Anyone who thinks this is to do with excess bone or massaging is changing it that fast needs to sit down and really think that through. Go through the success threads here - there is NO evidence or plausible medical explanation for skull shape changing.

Next thing - the vast majority of people here need only take care of themselves and follow the IH6 for basic health.

Your hairloss is unlikely to be cured by eliminating some parasite or imbalance or giving up wheat. For a few it works - but you won't find tons of success stories.

Over the years manual methods seem to have come on a lot - and there are going to be other methods that work well. I think it's worth accepting though - that there is a lot of hypochondria from people. It's understandable given the stress this causes but there is no need to muddy the waters on what is working.

There are a lot of good guys here who post and share more than they need to.

Then there are people who like to add in their belief that a chakra imbalance / water fluoridation / something else might regrow hair.

I can't say this strongly enough - manuals work. There are so many people posting. If you don't believe - that's fine - but you don't need to muddy the waters with whats already been covered. It really slows down progress.

For instance - people saying this could be calcification and talking about David Wolfe.

I know it's easy to get distracted and suffer from information overload - but come on!

Get results with manuals first - then try the other stuff. Or go prove what you're thinking and come back. Otherwise you are wasting your time. I say this because there are members here still chasing the next miracle detox, the next food to eliminate - and not making any progress.

Literally - one guy - he was completely random and a hypochondriac. Jumped in every thread to criticise people with results. Guess what - he's still here, made zero progress.

A little logic, research and planning can go a long way.

The calcification comments illustrate this. Think about it - what does lymphomema damage do? Yup - calcification - but your not going to find answers in David's coffee / coco bean therapy.

If you think so - go and try it - then and only then comment - until then it's only speculation. Even worse, it's speculation that lacks proof, anecdotal evidence, logic and is clearly not thought through.

So how am I doing with something that works?

Overall - I'm starting to see a very regular cycle of invisible vellus - long vellus - frosted hair - shed - thin hair. It takes about two weeks to go through this cycle - and I believe I'm seeing an acceleration of growth.

It's taken me a few years of the margo method to get my hairline growing again. Looking at photos - I have a better hairline now than I did in 2011. For me, that's a miracle.

My diffuse thinning can be covered up to an extent - but its obvious I don't have the thickest hair around.

Now it looks as if detumesance therapy will grow that back - the growth since I last posted is already visible!

I expect to be a solid NW3 or 2.5 this time next year with good coverage.

Hey gbp2000. I just wanted to respond because I brought up calcification and David Wolfe in the main detumesence thread.

Everything I said about calcification and David Wolfe was in support of detumesence. Not against it.

I was just trying to explain to people what that weird build up/formation was in their scalp. It is calcification.

If you check the 3 links I posted in the main thread...you will see that researchers noted that calcification was at the site of every man with hair loss. Well, David Wolfe had an excellent chapter on reversing calcification in one of his books. Wolfe noted that one way to reverse calcification was with deep tissue massage. i then simply stated that when people are performing detumesence...they are essentially doing deep tissue massage on their scalp which is reversing the calcification and is the reason why they feel these weird formations in their scalp.

Once people finish the 10 month detumesence protocol...their scalp should be fully decalcified and they should not feel the weird formations anymore. Furthermore, because they have no calcification in their scalp...they will have increased blood flow in their scalp..and will have increased hair growth.

At no point did I suggest anybody put coco bean in their scalp. I don't know where that came from.

Hey Hairhat - thanks for the clarification. David Wolfe talks about the applying the coco beans himself! I looked into it a lot and considered it and really, it was just a distraction that didn't work. I totally get what you are saying now - just focus on the massage. There are lots of things that may help, and people here will discover them - but unless you can figure out logically, what did what you can cause yourself world of hurt because you never figure out a system to fight this.

can we talk more about calcification please?

hiilikeyourbeard wrote:can we talk more about calcification please?  

Hey bro, what specifically would you like to know?

http://www.healthline.com/health/calcification

http://www.mcmillinmedia.com/eaem/marvel/instruct.html


Alopecia (Falling Hair)
    Use a weak current at first , and increase to a medium strength later on with electrode No. S3. Pass the comb back and forth over the entire scalp for about 4 minutes every day. Use the same treatment for baldness due to sickness and for gray hair in order to restore it to its natural color. Do not use Violet Ray immediately after using hair tonic.

Hairy Potter wrote:

hiilikeyourbeard wrote:can we talk more about calcification please?  

Hey bro, what specifically would you like to know?

i dunno i feel like we can do more, but maybe not. what about prevention? after we return our scalps to their natural state?

Odysseus wrote:

The Marvel Violet Ray Book of Instructions

Eastern Laboratories, Inc.

Undated (Early Twentieth Century)

http://www.mcmillinmedia.com/eaem/marvel/instruct.html


Alopecia (Falling Hair)
    Use a weak current at first , and increase to a medium strength later on with electrode No. S3. Pass the comb back and forth over the entire scalp for about 4 minutes every day. Use the same treatment for baldness due to sickness and for gray hair in order to restore it to its natural color. Do not use Violet Ray immediately after using hair tonic.

maybe this will convince me to use my violet ray haha, i was gonna start it up a few months ago and never got to it. first time i tried it it hurt and i was pretty turned off to it after that. felt like it could really hurt your follicles?

this is the attachment i bought for it

beard, don't turn it up too high. VR feels good if you set it properly for your tolerance. If it hurts you've got it up too high. Properly setting it may be slightly problematic at first since your device looks like one of the old style ones that doesn't have a visual way to assess the strength of the current (just a knob to turn with no visual markers), but with a few uses you'll figure out just by looking at the color/intensity of the light if you've got it at the right level for you.

Someone here used to say their scalp felt "activated" after properly using LLLT or massaging or violet ray or other manual methods. I find that descriptive term both accurate and amusing.

So, your scalp should feel "activated" after using the VR properly. If that makes any sense.

whodathunkit wrote:beard, don't turn it up too high.  VR feels good if you set it properly for your tolerance.  If it hurts you've got it up too high.  Properly setting it may be slightly problematic at first since your device looks like one of the old style ones that doesn't have a visual way to assess the strength of the current (just a knob to turn with no visual markers), but with a few uses you'll figure out just by looking at the color/intensity of the light if you've got it at the right level for you.

Someone here used to say their scalp felt "activated" after properly using LLLT or massaging or violet ray or other manual methods.  I find that descriptive term both accurate and amusing.

So, your scalp should feel "activated" after using the VR properly.  If that makes any sense.

that makes sense man thanks. i have to buy a new attatchment though i just broke mine on accident. i'll let you know when i get the new one. thanks man

hiilikeyourbeard wrote:

Hairy Potter wrote:

hiilikeyourbeard wrote:can we talk more about calcification please?  

Hey bro, what specifically would you like to know?

i dunno i feel like we can do more, but maybe not. what about prevention? after we return our scalps to their natural state?

Yup, I hear you. I think for me, being conscious of a fairly well-rounded diet will be a key factor.

Another factor will be how I respond to stress. When I started to lose my hair, I was in a very unhealthy place mentally and emotionally (from about 14 through my 20's). When I say 14 years old, I don't mean I started losing hair at that age obviously, but I did start in motion a habit of thought and 'being' that was anti-social and unhealthy, which led to me being extremely strung out throughout high school.

I was an early balder and already had a receding hairline in the last year of high school. I reckon how we choose to respond to what life throws at us has a massive impact on our overall health. Some are born with a naturally quite resilient nature, others have to work at it more.

In terms of what to do mechanically, I think I'll just keep on doing magnesium oil, a bit of DT in the shower, followed by Margo Method afterwards.

Maybe the biggest part of what I do will be the appropriation of what I believe we already have in the spirit - i.e.. perfect health.

So far, the ridge is starting to shift. I'm finding that the ridge further back from my hairline is now becoming a lot more pliable - and I can easily flatten it out in one session.

It does return - but each time becomes much easier.

I'm now convinced that this is due to the lyphodema damaged tissue begin replaced...

"I'm now convinced that this is due to the lyphodema damaged tissue begin replaced..."

can you explain this in retard terms?

Go to the first post in this thread, that probably explains my thoughts (not proven) best.