Why is Fin bad?

Is Fin bad because it inhibits DHT in the human body, and men do need DHT for proper body functioning? Are the side effects the result of this DHT inhibition?

Thanks?

Not really. Partly, but remember that things like equol reduce DHT and are nowhere near as harmful for most people.

Fin in my view is so bad because it strongly inhibits 5-alpha reductase, which has many negative effects beyond lowering DHT. It results in sexual sides, issues in the brain, and sometimes irreversible damage. In a perfect world, equol would be up to replacing finasteride tomorrow

Finasteride is bad because, it inhibits (irreversibly) 5-alpha reductase, it is the enzyme that also converts Brain 5-alpha-dihydroprogesterone and allopregnanolone.

5-alpha-dihydroprogesterone and allopregnanolone are considered neurosteroids. 5alpha-dihydroprogesterone binds with progesterone receptors for DNA activities (transcription factors). Allopregnanolone binds to gamma-aminobutyric acid GABA receptors.

In plain English, this means that without 5-alpha reductase, these two important neurosteroids are in very short supply, which will increase anxiety, depression and isolation tendencies.

I agree with CS with regard to depression, but unfortunately fin does help one to maintain hair. If you have not started on fin, don't. If you do, you may find that you will grow dependant on the drug to maintain whatever gains you have made. This has happened to me. I have tried to quite several times and have lost grown every time. It looks like I will have to make a difficult decision one day. Keep some hair and free myself of sides, or continue to suffer for the sake of a few more hair strands. Another thing to keep in mind is that fin does not work forever. I have been on it for ten years and have seen a slow decline over the last three.

CausticSymmetry wrote:Finasteride is bad because, it inhibits (irreversibly) 5-alpha reductase, it is the enzyme that also converts Brain 5-alpha-dihydroprogesterone and allopregnanolone.

5-alpha-dihydroprogesterone and allopregnanolone are considered neurosteroids. 5alpha-dihydroprogesterone binds with progesterone receptors for DNA activities (transcription factors). Allopregnanolone binds to gamma-aminobutyric acid GABA receptors.

In plain English, this means that without 5-alpha reductase, these two important neurosteroids are in very short supply, which will increase anxiety, depression and isolation tendencies.

and equol doesnt have these side effects? why?

Based on personal experience, fin is poison.

Quiting finasteride is the best decision I ever made...my body is slowly recovering from fin-related bromide intake and 5-alpha reductase derangement. The best supplement I"ve taken post-fin is iodine, hands down the most powerful supplement I've taken so far.

ezmbh -

double check with that equol thread, but I believe the equol doesnt act on the 5 - alpha reductase, just DHT. I'm not saying im sure that its perfectly safe, but it seems like many have said it is.

LA-Night wrote:The best supplement I"ve taken post-fin is iodine, hands down the most powerful supplement I've taken so far.

LA-Night - I've seen posts of yours where you've stated you've taken high amounts of iodine. When you first got off fin, how much were you taking on a typical day, and how long before you lowered the dose?

I would personally recommend to stay the hell away from fin/dutasteride! The psychological sides alone are pure hell! I made the mistake of going back on dut and it has completely disabled me and sent me into suicidal depression and anxiety. Not to mention the sexual sides, brain 'fog', and fatigue. I know it's hard to resist the temptation when your hair is getting worse, but being bald is an easy choice when it comes to these poisons IMO. I am actually considering asking the Dr. for some DHT cream to relieve some of this shit.

How about topical fin/dut? I read about some contradicting studies that were made and some said it worked just as good as oral and some said it did not give good results. But none of them said anything about sides. Does fin get absorbed a lot systematicallly? Anybody here used it topically?

I believe topical application of fin does get systematically absorbed in order to work, meaning you may as well swallow it.

As regards to fin, it depends where you ask...If you ask here, where the focus is on natural supplements you'll be told it's poison, if you ask in another forum you'll be told it's the best drug for hairloss and FDA approved.

I've been on Fin for 8 years now and never had any of those problems listed above, but some do, and i'm not denying the existence of side effects, temporary or otherwise. But, it's worked well for me....i'm not really a fan of pharmacuetical drugs, but's a matter of using those types of drugs, taking a natural hands on approach, or mixing and matching like me.

Equol is purported to "handcuff" DHT, so rather than inhibiting it, it locks it up. That way the 5-alpha reductase enzyme is not affected and proper hormone metabolites can be made.

The comments about the oral Equol that has been used so far agrees with what I had heard in the past, so this is part of the reason that maybe there's more to it than just the equol.

Or it could be the the products used so far are not the correct form of S-equol.

LooseGroove wrote:

LA-Night wrote:The best supplement I"ve taken post-fin is iodine, hands down the most powerful supplement I've taken so far.

LA-Night - I've seen posts of yours where you've stated you've taken high amounts of iodine. When you first got off fin, how much were you taking on a typical day, and how long before you lowered the dose?

LooseGroove,

I was taking anywhere between 100mg and 1000 mg of iodine per day immediately after I quit fin. It was about two months before I lowered the dose. Now I usually take 12.5 mg or 25 mg per day.

Is there really a difference between how beta-sis inhibits DHT and finasteride?

Beta Sis had no benefits for me at all, other than slowly affecting my mood.It took a long time to figure it out as it crept up slowly.

A week after stopping it, I returned to my normal sunny self. A few weeks later, tried beta sis again. Lo and behold the down mood returned.

I had all these sides with fina, and my hair loss was increase because my skin was really dry , my hair was very dry too , thin, fragile and felt like an age related mpb. It's pure shit.

Sometimes I really feel like just start using Fin, and hope that I don't experience sides (during or after use). I haven't found the regimen to stop my hairloss (yet, hopefully), and I feel like I am battling against time going the natural way, since nothing guarantees me that it will work. Atleast with Fin I have the experience of many users.

BUt OK, I know this is not the right forum for this kind of talk, so I'll stop.

LA-Night wrote: I was taking anywhere between 100mg and 1000 mg of
iodine per day immediately after I quit fin.

Wow. I recently got off Fin & Minox after about 3 years of use. Started taking the IH top 6 and Jarrows Toxinout. Also been taking about 3
droppers full of Iosol a day. I thought I was overdoing it with the Iosol. Aside from a few pimples and some "brain fog" in the morning, I
haven't been feeling any of the side effects that many people report when starting this type of regimen.

LA or CS - I've been doing a lot of research recently. It's become apparent that I have some thyroid issues (low core temperature, fatigue,
cold hands and feet). Since I haven't been feeling any negative side effects of taking these supplements, would it be more beneficial to
gradually up my dose of iodine to levels that LA was taking when he first got off fin or is that much iodine overkill?

LooseGroove,

I highly recommend anyone to read up on iodine supplementation before megadosing, as it can be tough on your body initially. Along with this forum, the curezone iodine forum was a goldmine of information.

In my case, I had other issues beside finasteride-related bromide -- namely heavy metal toxicity & subtle hypothyroidism I didn't know I had until I detoxed. My body was aching with fluoride, chlorine, bromide & even mercury passed down to me at birth. It didn't get bad until I took a job as a swim instructor at an indoor swimming pool where I'd leave my shift literally drenched in chemicals. A few months after starting the job, I began to experience intense anxiety, lethargy & yup, hair loss. Going on finasteride only made it much, much worse.

Iodine, citrus pectin & even humifulvate cleansed my system, and I slowly recovered. The result for my hair? Increased thickness, even in the problematic temple region. The only reason I megadosed iodine was because I suspected I still had metals & toxins deep in my tissues. The subsequent detox proved my suspicion to be correct.

Anyway, if you do increase your dose of iodine just educate yourself first & monitor your body. Be sure to take selenium & vitamin C while salt loading.

Thanks for the advice LA. I appreciate your input. One last question, after you did your initial detox, you continued taking iodine at a much lower dose. How long did it take for your hair to get to the level it's at now?

LooseGroove wrote:Thanks for the advice LA. I appreciate your input. One last question, after you did your initial detox, you continued taking iodine at a much lower dose. How long did it take for your hair to get to the level it's at now?

It's taken about a year or so...

LA-Night wrote:LooseGroove,

I highly recommend anyone to read up on iodine supplementation before megadosing, as it can be tough on your body initially. Along with this forum, the curezone iodine forum was a goldmine of information.

In my case, I had other issues beside finasteride-related bromide -- namely heavy metal toxicity & subtle hypothyroidism I didn't know I had until I detoxed. My body was aching with fluoride, chlorine, bromide & even mercury passed down to me at birth. It didn't get bad until I took a job as a swim instructor at an indoor swimming pool where I'd leave my shift literally drenched in chemicals. A few months after starting the job, I began to experience intense anxiety, lethargy & yup, hair loss. Going on finasteride only made it much, much worse.

Iodine, citrus pectin & even humifulvate cleansed my system, and I slowly recovered. The result for my hair? Increased thickness, even in the problematic temple region. The only reason I megadosed iodine was because I suspected I still had metals & toxins deep in my tissues. The subsequent detox proved my suspicion to be correct.

Anyway, if you do increase your dose of iodine just educate yourself first & monitor your body. Be sure to take selenium & vitamin C while salt loading.

LA – Night, did you have, or do you have any GI Tract inflammation issues? If so, what affect did iodine have?
I have been suffering from intermittent GI Tract inflammation since mid 08. Identifying the root cause has proven very challenging, but I am still working on it.