Low sugar/carb diet or low oxalate diet?

So, in summary of this thread, oxalates are bad then

lol


So odd isn't it that something that is in so many fantastic fruits and veg and stuff, can be so bad for us. It truly proves that not even nature (or even the nature we allow ourselves to eat regularly) is perfect.

I think my plan is, what the hey, I'll go low on this stuff too lol

My attitude is I can always REintroduce things later, and I'm on multivits anyway, but the longer I umm and ahh, the more I might be impacting my thyroid and the more hair I may ultimately lose, you know? I need to hit this problem on the head!

And woah calcium supplements are dangerous O.O oh my I've been taking TONS! Dayum ._. Problem is I thought I needed it for magnesium absorption.

In the long run I fully intend to really get into the details of my ancestral type and outline the perfect diet for me! I'm aware that may take time though, and so for now, I'll just play it safe I think!

Hoppi

http://nutrition.suite101.com/article.cfm/a_low_oxalate_diet

That site says Vitamin D and fish oil supplements should be limited or avoided in a low oxalate diet. Is this reason to stop?

Hmm. I don't think I would use it as a reason to AVOID vits C & D and fish oils, but maybe just not go really overboard, I may cut down my vitamin C intake a bit.

I would imagine that as long as you stick by and large to low oxalate foods, possibly with a few mediums thrown in, and don't go overboard on vitamin C and that, you're probably fine.

For me I intend to yeah, make my diet REALLY strict, and then gradually relax it more and more as I discover which foods my body can tolerate well. I may find for example that my body is fantastic with gluten or with dairy, or with fruit, or whatever, so I can put it back in with confidence! But, time will tell

tooyoung wrote:http://nutrition.suite101.com/article.cfm/a_low_oxalate_diet

That site says Vitamin D and fish oil supplements should be limited or avoided in a low oxalate diet. Is this reason to stop?

I would say no.

The reasons suggested are not very strong. Ester C decreases oxalates, as previously mentioned here.

Certainly Vitamin D will help retain calcium, but there's a good reason for this. There's no scientific evience to suggest any benefit by limiting vitamin D to help rid oxalates, in fact just the opposite.

Wouldn't drop the fish oil either.

To add to CS, Vitamin D is said to interfere with citrates ability to remove already existing oxalates stored in the tissues, organs, etc..

Solution = if taking citrate (e.g. calcium citrate, lemons, etc.) then your Vitamin D supplement at opposite end of the day. Personally, for this reason, when I feel like I need more Vitamin D I'll take 50,000 IU. Of course, you wouldn't take this dose more than once per week.

Sort of related to dropping supps. After around 2-3 months now I'm not feeling any benefit from d3,k2,curcumin and krill. It is time for me to reorder and I was thinking of just getting some selenium and iodine and I have many symptoms of thyroid problems and I have suspected thyroid was a problem for me for a while. Also, my sister yesterday cut my hair and I she said that I definetly wasn't losing my hair - My hairline to me looks as it is retreating though. What do you guys think?

Well, the thing is man, if you ask me this is more about outlining underlying triggers, and focusing your regimen and approach on THEM.

Is your DHT too high maybe? If it is, then curb it temporarily with a low Fin dose or beta-sitosterol, and then try to work out why it is elevated. Do you have inflammation? IF so why? Diet, stress, thyroid? If it's your thyroid, then WHY is it your thyroid? Can you fix that with dietary changes or lifestyle changes (reducing stress, heavy metals, chemicals?).

My point being that the more you focus on what you believe to be the actual triggers, the more luck you will probably have!

For me I suspected bad diet, stress, thyroid and possibly adrenals.

So, Finasteride and Keto are my "quick fixes", cur + res are quick fixes also (for me, IMO), but also lower stress-related inflammation I believe

Schisandra and ashwagandha are good for stress and thyroid, gotu kola will smooth out my circulation. This also all makes my T and E levels healthy. Lignans increase my SHBG.

My diet is totally, totally non-inflammatory, high fibre, mid range protein, low carbs. Non-processed, no soy, etc, no gluten, dairy, low oxalates.

And I'm removing my fillings and dropping all tap water and chemicals! I'm basically trying to give my thyroid as much room to recover by itself as I possibly can, the multivits should help too!

Then of course, if my thyroid is incapable of self-correction, I will treat it in whichever way seems the most appropriate for me

I will monitor my TSH and cortisol (and possibly DHT) levels, so as to ensure that I'm along the right track!

But yah! Oh also, lipoic acid and ALC chelate mercury (from my filling), increase mitochondrial energy (to offset hypothyroid) and reduce my blood sugar, which was a little high!

I know it's WELL complicated lol, it's just that I really want to outline the problems, and tackle them one by one until my body is fine again!

Just to add my two cents.. after reading Hoppi's post, it turns out I have been treating the similar symptoms. After getting advice from a lot of sources, including IH and JDP and Prague on this forum Ive basically been following the IH regimen with the addition of a few things:

1) REMOVING/FLUSHING TOXINS - In addition to taking and doing all the things, that the IH regimen, and this forum encourages you to focus on, Im also trying to flush out all toxins and improper minerals -heavy metals, bromides/ fluorides, and aluminum. But to this end Im following along the lines of what JDP and Prague and others have been doing - high-dose iodine, selenium, cilantro, chlorella, metal shield, salt-flushes when necessary, etc. (Im taking the entire regimen everyday in addition to other things like hyaluronic acid and ashwangda 2 x day, and niacimide with each meal. Im also following the low oxalate diet that JDP has been writing so much about and the toxicity avoidance that Hoppi outlined above).

2) MINERAL REBALANCE - Im attempting to rebalance my body's natural mineral levels - I feel you pretty much have to do this in order to achieve part-1 of this list anyway, as your body will hold on to minerals it is low in. So by taking the right mineral supplements I am killing two birds with one stone so to speak.. This is only the tip of the iceberg. there is so much I have learned about this I could write 10 pages on this topic without stopping I feel like.

But to assist with parts-1 & 2, Im probably going to add french green clay, negative hydrogen (900 to 1200 mg a day), Organic germanium, probably the form (colloidal?) that Prague has previously recommended, renewal antioxidants that IH has recommended as well as Molybdenum and Indium.

3) I felt like my vitamin D levels were probably low, esp over the winter months, so Ive been taking large doses of vit. D as well as going tanning one or two times a week (from all Ive read the negatives are far outweighed by the positives as long as one refrains from burning.) And of course during the summer I make sure to get plenty of natural sunlight.

FYI - Im looking at adding enzymes as well. Im leaning towards taking a bunch of different stuff including serrapeptase, bromlain, & pancreatin. Im also looking at mega dosing with K2. As well as adding tocotrienols, Toco-8 as Ive heard it can increase hair regrowth. I think the Ultimate Zapper as well would make a great addition when I have the money.

I feel like this course of action will greatly benefit me. I already feel and look better then I have in years and Im only half way there.. that being said there is always more I could be doing and more I dont yet know about. So if anyone has anything to add to assist I would appreciate..

Wow lots of new stuff for me to think about there too! Thanks for the info JS

I just wanted to add that Wikipedia has a good list of high oxalate foods.

Additionally if you know of any and the amount they contain, you could always add them to the list on there and make it a bit more comprehensive!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxalate#Occurrence_in_nature

I often hear spinach, kale, and parsley listed as the most healthy vegetables, yet all of them are high in oxalates. Do people here think they should be avoided outright for these reasons?

albe wrote:I often hear spinach, kale, and parsley listed as the most healthy vegetables, yet all of them are high in oxalates. Do people here think they should be avoided outright for these reasons?

I've head that raw is fine in regard to these veggies when it comes to oxalates (don't have any sources to back it up).

Probiotics are protectors against oxalates. I would use human strains of probiotics along with a prebiotic like acacia senegal daily... and I do, with great results in digestion.

Fixing your gut (permeability and flora) will keep you safe.

As I've been learning from posts here, oxalates seem to be really problematic when your gut is messed up such as when you have leaky gut syndrome, for any reason, like candida species and other pathogens.

So Littlefighter what probiotic do you recommend? I was looking at Theralac due to the expense and ease. It also has a strain that is very good against dandruff. However, im still undecided.

DBAL,

Don't mean to jump in for Littlefighter but the only probiotic that would be noteworthy for oxalate eating probiotics is VSL#3.

Sure, "lactobacillus acidophilus is an oxalate-eating species" as well as others but just so-so.

Best to consume calcium before a meal unless you're rich. Not to mention probiotics are aluminum based which further degardes the real beneficial yttrium based probiotics (a reason why I'm not big on probiotics). Anyway, calcium binds to oxalates. Without the calcium or enough probiotics to eat the oxalates, this is how leaky gut gets created in the first place.

This is all if you have an oxalate issue in the first place. One way to check is to go on an low oxalate diet. If after a couple days you feel horrible and feel like you're starving to death and crave high oxalate foods, then you have an oxalate problem.

hope this helps

Thanks JDP. I thought calcium wasnt needed as a supplement?

Done some research on VSL and it seems a pretty potent probiotic. Downside is the price.

Been reading up on the SCD diet - pretty sure this would address oxolates as well. I think oxolates could be a big issue with me because my inflammation hasnt changed since being on IH6 and stopped gluten and sugars.

Same boat that DBAL, and I just read endives are high in oxalate, and I eat a lot of it, almost every meal. Damn it. Ok so I think I will replace it with lettuce or something. I'm not a big meat or fish eater, so my main food is brown rice, and it appears to be a nice food in this forum.

I read also pepper was high in oxalate, is it true?

yea it is a pain. Every morning I eat a large bowl of steel oats oatmeal (with cinnamon) and I love it. However, it is high in oxolates. Ive tried eating brown rice porridge, but it isnt very nice and I already eat a lot of brown rice (both rice and rice pasta).


Any ideas for a substantial breakfast?!

Calcium isn't needed unless you have an oxalate problem/leaky gut problem.

http://www.lowoxalate.info/papers/mechanisms.html

The only real information regarding oxalates is one place.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Trying_Low_Oxalates

There is a wealth of information at that site ... way more than I want to copy and paste. The problem is the information is all over the place. There also is something like a 40+ plus page at celiac.com regarding those who have a gluten sensitivity and their experience with it.

Regarding pepper, not sure as it's the nightshade family and I avoid food in the nightshade family. They bring on pain.

Also, keep in mind that while fruits and vegetables contain oxalates, your body also produces oxalates naturally. You body will create excess oxalates if deficient in B6 and magnesium for example.

There really is "a lot" more to it than just avoiding high oxalate foods.

hope this helps