Mind Blowing Interview (Paleo diet is just the start...there's much more...it's making waves in the paleo community)

[tudor]

http://itsrainmakingtime.com/2012/jackkruse/
http://www.fatburningman.com/interview-with-dr-jack-kruse-neurosurgeon-cold-thermogenesis-and-leptin-reset-podcast-video/
TED TALK https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qNEeqCACwo

[steve215]

So he's telling us to take cold showers, sleep when sun goes down, and eat a low carb diet?

[AS54]

Go to his blog. He's got a document called the "Quilt" there. I'm knee deep trying to research all of the different levees of this document right now. But I think its a treasure trove of knowledge and a different perspective on health than I've experienced. I think combined with some other doctors (like Klinghardt), you could have the most comprehensive guide to health and longevity available to us at this point.

[scottyc33]

Go to his blog. He's got a document called the "Quilt" there. I'm knee deep trying to research all of the different levees of this document right now. But I think its a treasure trove of knowledge and a different perspective on health than I've experienced. I think combined with some other doctors (like Klinghardt), you could have the most comprehensive guide to health and longevity available to us at this point.

Good call!

[crincrin]

Some crazy but interesting stuff on that guy's blog. Has anyone tried this cold thermogenesis protocol?

[AS54]

Only just recently started it...about five days in. I will be honest, it is awful. I think he recommends starting just by dunking your face repeatedly and then moving into the baths later. I just said to hell with it and tried the bath. I've been doing about 10 minutes, and it really feels kind of tortuous. Your body goes numb. But the feeling after you are out and dried off is incredible. You are completely invigorated and the blood flow is amazing. Can't say whether I'm seeing the "leptin reset" benefits as of yet. I'm going to monitor it over six weeks and hopefully steadily increase my time in the water to closer to 45 minutes or so. But apparently the cold causes leptin to completely drop off.

[tooyoung]

steadily increase my time in the water to closer to 45 minutes or so.

Is he suggesting you stay in a cold bath for 45 minutes? Wouldn't that be stressful on the body and potentially dangerous?

[steve215]

Only just recently started it...about five days in. I will be honest, it is awful. I think he recommends starting just by dunking your face repeatedly and then moving into the baths later. I just said to hell with it and tried the bath. I've been doing about 10 minutes, and it really feels kind of tortuous. Your body goes numb. But the feeling after you are out and dried off is incredible. You are completely invigorated and the blood flow is amazing. Can't say whether I'm seeing the "leptin reset" benefits as of yet. I'm going to monitor it over six weeks and hopefully steadily increase my time in the water to closer to 45 minutes or so. But apparently the cold causes leptin to completely drop off.

Are you just using tap water or also using ice?

[tooyoung]

Jack kruse suggests,
"DO NOT let your temperature fall below 50-55 degrees"

and according to this site
http://www.seagrant.umn.edu/coastal_communities/hypothermia

at 50-60F it would take potentially an hour to kill you and 1-2 hours before you become unconscious. Am I missing something because this sounds fucking stupid lol.

[scottyc33]

Only just recently started it...about five days in. I will be honest, it is awful. I think he recommends starting just by dunking your face repeatedly and then moving into the baths later. I just said to hell with it and tried the bath. I've been doing about 10 minutes, and it really feels kind of tortuous. Your body goes numb. But the feeling after you are out and dried off is incredible. You are completely invigorated and the blood flow is amazing. Can't say whether I'm seeing the "leptin reset" benefits as of yet. I'm going to monitor it over six weeks and hopefully steadily increase my time in the water to closer to 45 minutes or so. But apparently the cold causes leptin to completely drop off.

Do you really need to do it that long to realize benefits?

I've been doing cold water at the end of my morning shower for about 2 minutes.

[nidhogge]

There is definitely something to plunging your body into cold and even freezing water. Perhaps people have heard of the cryochambers used by the Dallas Mavericks and other teams out there? It's catching on like wildfire, but here's a link on it:

http://www.austin360.com/recreation/cryochamber-more-comfortable-than-an-ice-bath-but-1504222.html?printArticle=y

[tooyoung]

There is definitely something to plunging your body into cold and even freezing water. Perhaps people have heard of the cryochambers used by the Dallas Mavericks and other teams out there? It's catching on like wildfire, but here's a link on it:

http://www.austin360.com/recreation/cryochamber-more-comfortable-than-an-ice-bath-but-1504222.html?printArticle=y

That talks about 15-20 minutes... but 45 minutes as jack kruse suggests?

[AS54]

Yeah, I agree that Kruse's recs are a little too long to be practical. I think he actually says you should work your way up to an hour in 50-55 degree water. That is an extremely long time. I wish there were some studies that could tell us whether the minimum effective time would be less than that. I'm gonna see what I can turn up.

[AS54]

Found this interesting. According to this study 25 minutes lowered leptin levels by 14% and 60 minutes of immersion lowered it by 22%. So 63% of the decrease in the hour happened in the first 25 minutes. I think carried out over time, this strategy could be just as effective 25 minutes, but that would all depend on how quickly leptin recovers afterward.

[url=http://aups.org.au/Proceedings/32(2)Suppl.1/188P/188P.pdf]http://aups.org.au/Proceedings/32(2)Suppl.1/188P/188P.pdf[/url

By the way, I am using ice. I get the water to around 55-60. I don't have a skin thermometer but should get one, as Kruse says the ideal is to get the skin temp to 50-55. But again, if this could be done is 20-25 min. I think that would be sufficient. I'm not so sure that 45-60 min. is necessary. I am not familiar with how fast the skin cools down to the cold stimulus though.

[scottyc33]

Found this interesting. According to this study 25 minutes lowered leptin levels by 14% and 60 minutes of immersion lowered it by 22%. So 63% of the decrease in the hour happened in the first 25 minutes. I think carried out over time, this strategy could be just as effective 25 minutes, but that would all depend on how quickly leptin recovers afterward.

[url=http://aups.org.au/Proceedings/32(2)Suppl.1/188P/188P.pdf]http://aups.org.au/Proceedings/32(2)Suppl.1/188P/188P.pdf[/url

By the way, I am using ice. I get the water to around 55-60. I don't have a skin thermometer but should get one, as Kruse says the ideal is to get the skin temp to 50-55. But again, if this could be done is 20-25 min. I think that would be sufficient. I'm not so sure that 45-60 min. is necessary. I am not familiar with how fast the skin cools down to the cold stimulus though.

Good find.

Damn 25 minutes in an ice bath does not sound like fun at all.

[hadrion]

Hey guys,

I'm already doing a form of this. In 4 Hour Body Tim Ferris talks about cold therapy and he recommends at minimum to put an ice pack on the back of your neck/top of your shoulders for 20 minutes a day. You should see some small benefit there. I'm also taking all my showers from warm to very cold and I stay in the very cold for as long as I can take it before getting out.

Can't say I've seen any ridiculous results in 8 weeks of this but my body has changed in this time period. I've dropped bodyfat but gained so much muscle mass that I've barely lost any weight but look much different.

And I'm doing low carb - the only carbs I'm touching have a Glycemic Idex of 40 or under and a GL (glycemic load) of 10 or under. This is working very well for me with a cheat meal/day built into each week.

Not ready for ice baths just yet. That's gonna be tough.

[scottyc33]

"Can't say I've seen any ridiculous results in 8 weeks of this but my body has changed in this time period. I've dropped bodyfat but gained so much muscle mass that I've barely lost any weight but look much different."

Are you doing anything different exercise wise?

[nidhogge]

There is definitely something to plunging your body into cold and even freezing water. Perhaps people have heard of the cryochambers used by the Dallas Mavericks and other teams out there? It's catching on like wildfire, but here's a link on it:

http://www.austin360.com/recreation/cryochamber-more-comfortable-than-an-ice-bath-but-1504222.html?printArticle=y

That talks about 15-20 minutes... but 45 minutes as jack kruse suggests?

Yea, but cryochambers are a lot different than ice baths (far colder). I'm sure that Jack would agree that 45 minutes would be way too much in a cryochamber.

By the way, this whole thing about plunging your body in ice cold water is nothing new...Russians and Slavs in general have done this throughout history to promote health and longevity, and Rickson Gracie is shown doing it in the documentary "Choke" that follows him winning a PRIDE Mixed Martial Arts championship. The Gracies are known for their insanely strict lifestyle when it comes to diet and exercise.

[hadrion]

"Can't say I've seen any ridiculous results in 8 weeks of this but my body has changed in this time period. I've dropped bodyfat but gained so much muscle mass that I've barely lost any weight but look much different."

Are you doing anything different exercise wise?

I'm doing 75 2 handed kettlebell swings with a 44lb bell 2-3 times a week. Then I'm doing one handed swings with a 25lb kettlebell where I alternate hand to hand on the upswing for 20x.

After that, I do the Body For Life upper body workout 1x a week and the Body For Life lower body workout 1x a week.

Then 3 days a week I do HIIT cardio - these days I don't do kettlebells or resistance. It's just a 20-25 minute session of intervals. I do them on different things like the spin bike, the stair climber, the rowing machine, the versa climber and the Cybex Arc trainer.

The longest workout is about 45-50 minutes with kettlebells and resistance. My cardio intervals have me out of the gym in a 1/2 hour.

I don't know if these are entirely accurate, but on the bodyfat impedence scale they let me use at my gym it appears I've lost 22lbs of bodyfat and put on 16 pounds of muscle in 8 weeks.

I'm eating 3 meals a day - as much protein as I can handle, veggies carbs (usually spinach) and carbs that fall under 40 on the GI and 10 on the GL mixed into the diet. I'm snacking on almonds and almond butter in moderation. Using avocado in my meals. Cooking only in coconut oil and kerrygold butter. Pretty much avoiding dairy other than heavy cream in my coffee with stevia. I'm also drinking Yerba Matte a few times a week. I'm never hungry eating like this and I've completely lost my taste for alcohol.

[AS54]

Hadrion,

I really like your workout routine. It pretty much approximates where I'm trying to take my workouts. I have only just started experimenting with kettlebells,
but its a whole different stimulus. I like that it really impacts the entire body in one movement and permits you to do so much more than using a straight bar.
But I'm also trying to widdle my resistance bouts down to a two-split, upper and lower once a week as well. I'm not sure if you're familiar with Doug McGuff,
but his recommendation is to only hit a muscle group hard once per week. According to him, the workout incites a genetic stimulus and the muscle building adaptation takes one week to complete and re-introducing the stimulus (workout) too early shuts down that signal and restarts it, not really allowing you to adapt. I find that very interesting, and I can recall reading an experiment done on a male athlete that tried to recreate the exercise patterns of a male gorilla by using a once-a-week full body routine. Apparently, the lean mass gains were great.

Nid,

I thought that was very interesting how this cold therapy has been in use for so long but never really hit the "mainstream". I wonder why that is, because it would appear that it has some incredible results. In mother Russia, trees paint Bob Ross. Haha.

[hadrion]

Hadrion,

I really like your workout routine. It pretty much approximates where I'm trying to take my workouts. I have only just started experimenting with kettlebells,
but its a whole different stimulus. I like that it really impacts the entire body in one movement and permits you to do so much more than using a straight bar.
But I'm also trying to widdle my resistance bouts down to a two-split, upper and lower once a week as well. I'm not sure if you're familiar with Doug McGuff,
but his recommendation is to only hit a muscle group hard once per week. According to him, the workout incites a genetic stimulus and the muscle building adaptation takes one week to complete and re-introducing the stimulus (workout) too early shuts down that signal and restarts it, not really allowing you to adapt. I find that very interesting, and I can recall reading an experiment done on a male athlete that tried to recreate the exercise patterns of a male gorilla by using a once-a-week full body routine. Apparently, the lean mass gains were great.

Nid,

I thought that was very interesting how this cold therapy has been in use for so long but never really hit the "mainstream". I wonder why that is, because it would appear that it has some incredible results. In mother Russia, trees paint Bob Ross. Haha.

Anthony - Interesting stuff. Can you post a routine or have a link to one similar to what you mentioned? I don't feel I need to do upper body more than once a week any longer. I'm huge right now. Between the diet and supplements thanks to Nid & CS, I'm having no trouble packing on muscle mass and retaining it. I'm still holding belly fat though. It's frustrating. That's going to be the last to go I guess.

[AS54]

Hadrion,

I'll put a few links to the things I've read by him. I am going to order his book "Body by Science", but haven't done so yet. The second is a video of him speaking at a dating convention so on top of workout philosophy, there is also some of his views on how to attract women, haha. But he was invited to speak there because its basically a men's workshop on how to better yourself. Its a great lecture. One of the few doctors I've seen whose advice I believe I can trust just by looking at him.

The first link is to his interview with Mercola.

http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/01/06/dr-doug-mcguff-on-exercise.aspx

[hadrion]

Hadrion,

I'll put a few links to the things I've read by him. I am going to order his book "Body by Science", but haven't done so yet. The second is a video of him speaking at a dating convention so on top of workout philosophy, there is also some of his views on how to attract women, haha. But he was invited to speak there because its basically a men's workshop on how to better yourself. Its a great lecture. One of the few doctors I've seen whose advice I believe I can trust just by looking at him.

The first link is to his interview with Mercola.

http://fitness.mercola.com/sites/fitness/archive/2012/01/06/dr-doug-mcguff-on-exercise.aspx

anthony - check your PM's here

[crincrin]

"Dr. Jack Kruse, Neurosurgeon, is a Big Fucking Liar"

http://freetheanimal.com/2012/05/dr-jack-kruse-neurosurgeon-is-a-big-fucking-liar.html

[RPM]

I'm a big fan of Doug McGuff too. I consider him the third generation of High Intensity Training advocates after Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer(all of whom are great reads) Body By Science is probably the most enlightening book I've read in the last few years. Hope this doesn't spur the standard HIT vs Volume Training vitriol.

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