The Fallacy Of Blood Flow As A Non Factor In Balding.... And What To Do About it...

Nice tip, 9rugrats5! OMG also advocates putting saltwater on your hair to "voluminize" it. Do you find it makes your hair seem thicker? It would be nice to kill two birds with one stone...

FWIW, by the time I get done at night with Papi, brushing, Maliniak massage, and 8 minutes of the violet ray, my scalp is tingling like mad, in a very pleasant way. Sometimes I don't do these all at once, sometimes I Papi and brush earlier, then Maliniak and VR right before bed, but still get tingling throughout. My scalp also still feels "activated" in the morning (like right now, feels good).

Thank you, too, whodathunkit. I didn't check in the mirror if it makes the hair look thicker, but i think it might and the hair probably stand up 'straighter' after the salt water rub. hat said, i oil the hair a bit too, which weighs them down, so the effect of salt alone is not apparent to me.

Your regimen sounds good! Do keep us posted if you see progress.

gbp2000 wrote:That's fantastic. Thankyou so much for the feedback and tip.
I've seen enough proof and testimonials from the past 30 or so years to know it works.

Hey gbp,
This proof comes from PP's e-book?

Man, i really want to take a good picture of my head to show everyone that new tiny hairs are coming out of the scalp.

Hey GT,

The proof comes from the late 70s book that was advertised in Rolling Stone / Weekly News etc. A lot of the writer's customers - who left testimonials - were public figures at various points - you can find up to date photos of. Some of them are bald now, many have some balding, a few have no balding.

Seeing as it's 30 years ago - it's pretty clear they have done well - I doubt many stuck with it as they got into their late 60s etc - so to my mind that alone shows it works. Plus the numerous testimonials from normal people dotted around the net.

Currently - the front of my scalp has erupted in spots - both a bit suprising and painful. This has started since I have increased the "range" of the method for want of a better word.

For New People: I'm under NDA to Papilla Power - I've no intention of sharing any book with you, or pointing you to places to get this information for free. Nor am I going to share the original book with you - I've written enough, as have others - that if you are really bothered you can find it yourself. I'm really sorry to say this - but I can't keep replying to the same PMs over and over.

gbp2000 wrote:Hey GT,

The proof comes from the late 70s book that was advertised in Rolling Stone / Weekly News etc. A lot of the writer's customers - who left testimonials - were public figures at various points - you can find up to date photos of. Some of them are bald now, many have some balding, a few have no balding.

Seeing as it's 30 years ago - it's pretty clear they have done well - I doubt many stuck with it as they got into their late 60s etc - so to my mind that alone shows it works. Plus the numerous testimonials from normal people dotted around the net.

Currently - the front of my scalp has erupted in spots - both a bit suprising and painful. This has started since I have increased the "range" of the method for want of a better word.

For New People: I'm under NDA to Papilla Power - I've no intention of sharing any book with you, or pointing you to places to get this information for free. Nor am I going to share the original book with you - I've written enough, as have others - that if you are really bothered you can find it yourself. I'm really sorry to say this - but I can't keep replying to the same PMs over and over.

In the beginning, i was trying to achieve a more defined hairline. So i was rubbing vigorously near the hairlines to a point where my skin peeled off. Oh man, was my forehead "tingling." LOL.

Nice thread here. In the past there was discussions that might have gone over people's heads, however now it is a good time to review some earlier info.

By the way, gbp2000 is right on the money in my opinion.

The whole situation with hair comes down to oxygen.

What would interfere with oxygen transport?

Well, an impaired thyroid for one, which invites infection, which equals inflammation.

What happens when there is inflammation? Less oxygen.

When the thyroid is impaired, what happens to oxygen transfer? It goes down, infection rises.

Iodine has been shown since the early 1900's to clear up obstructions in the arterial system. If you haven't heard this
before, it only means that the medical cartel has succeeded in promoting their agenda--selling petrochemical poisons and getting worse.

There are other factors to keep the blood thin, because as we age, our blood viscosity gets thicker.
More info on heart disease here and a little on blood viscosity: http://healthyfixx.com/42/clogged-arteries-do-not-cause-heart-attacks

Ecklonia Cava, the vitamin E family and K2 will keep the vascular system and more free flowing.

Regarding hypoxia: more info here: https://immortalhair.forumotion.com/t6991-revisiting-important-findings-implications-for-de-novo-hair-growth

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/1939518/

"During the low iodine diet, excretion dropped to 0.49 +/- 0.16 mumol/day, and blood flow increased to 11.0 +/- 5.0 mL/min (P less than 0.001), remaining elevated (10.3 +/- 4.4 mL/min) during the second baseline diet. During high iodide intake, blood flow averaged 5.8 +/- 3.4 mL/min (P less than 0.001), and the expected decrease in thyroid hormone levels and increase in TSH were seen"

hellwing...is what you cited, specifically the high iodine part a good thing?

hellwig wrote:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/1939518/

"During the low iodine diet, excretion dropped to 0.49 +/- 0.16 mumol/day, and blood flow increased to 11.0 +/- 5.0 mL/min (P less than 0.001), remaining elevated (10.3 +/- 4.4 mL/min) during the second baseline diet. During high iodide intake, blood flow averaged 5.8 +/- 3.4 mL/min (P less than 0.001), and the expected decrease in thyroid hormone levels and increase in TSH were seen"

TSH does not measure thyroid hormone accurately. Also, there is a transient raise in TSH within 6-months of iodine usage.
There are a lot of past posts on this subject some years ago (which explains the important details) when detractors attacked iodine usage on every conceivable level.

I just thought it was interesting that when I searched "iodine bloodflow" this study came up saying iodine actually decreased bloodflow as well as decreasing thyroid hormone.

I've been taken iodine for i don't know 3 years now? i feel great. Not sure about the bloodflow thing though.

Do you attribute feeling great to taking iodine?

hellwig wrote:Do you attribute feeling great to taking iodine?

i am on a variation of IH's top 6 such as maca, vit d, magnesium, sensoril...but iodine has always been a part of the regimen. I had a slight depression, and the regimen in my experience helped a lot. Could it just be iodine? i don't know.

GoodThings ...how much iodine do you take?

I purchased chlorophyll a few months ago for reasons not related to hair loss, more for ED type stuff (which it actually helped a lot with). I recently have been thinking about reintroducing it, and CS's post above regarding oxygen reminded me of what I've read about chlorophyll's effects on oxygen. I am not sure if this is official and backed by science because I don't think there is too much science/experiments on it, but I did a quick google search and pulled some info related to oxygen that you may find interesting. BTW, I bought chlorophyll in a little liquid vial from whole foods. I know it boosted my sex drive for sure.. so it's def. has some kind of health benefits.. not sure in the way it did it though.

If we look at oxygen as a bullet to kill cancer cells, then we should look at wheatgrass as a shotgun blast at treating cancer. The number of ways it deals with cancer is incredible. First of all it contains chlorophyll, which has almost the same molecular structure as hemoglobin. Chlorophyll increases hemoglobin production, meaning more oxygen gets to the cancer. Selenium and laetrile are also in wheatgrass, both are anticancer. Chlorophyll and selenium also help build the immunity system. Furthermore, wheatgrass is one of the most alkaline foods known to mankind. And the list goes on.

http://www.cancertutor.com/Cancer/Wheatgrass.html

So in addition to helping to rebuild and replenish our red blood cells, chlorophyll, being highly alkaline, also gives the body the following benefits:

* Anti Carcinogenic: Chlorophyll protects against a whole host of carcinogens found in fungus-laden foods such as nuts and grains, the toxins from cooked meats, and air-borne carcinogens (from pollution). It blocks the metabolism in the body of harmful chemicals known as procarcinogens that damage DNA. Studies published in the journals Carcinogenesis and Food and Chemical Toxicology clearly display that chlorophyll inhibits carcinogenesis.
* Antioxidant & Anti-inflammatory: containing high levels of the vitamins A, C and E, chlorophyll has strong antioxidant capacity and has also been found to help reduce inflammation.
* Chelation of Heavy Metals: chlorophyll is one of the most important chelates in nature. It’s ability to bind to and remove toxic heavy metals such as mercury makes it an extremely powerful healer. I’m about to have four mercury fillings removed, and you can bet that I will be getting PLENTY of chlorophyll into my body after the procedure!
* Antiseptic: while chlorophyll doesn’t actually have antiseptic properties of its own, it, quite remarkably, DOES have the ability to aid our body’s tissue in destroying germs. By strengthening tissue, it increases the disease resistance of cells and, at the same time, prevents the growth of bacteria!
* Treats Bad Breath: This one is a real bonus and really works! Chlorophyll has a double-action remedy for bad breath. Firstly, as a deodoriser, it will eliminate odours in the mouth and throat, but secondly (and more importantly) it promotes a healthy digestive tract - which is the primary reason for bad breath.
* Rapid Delivery of Magnesium: this has a highly alkalising effect on the body and helps to deliver much needed oxygen to cells and tissues.
* Contains vitamin K, C, folic acid, iron, calcium, protein: which are all also essential in building and repairing red blood cells and boosting our immune system.

http://beyourowndoctornow.blogspot.com/2009/07/benefits-of-chlorophyll.html

The second website looks like it could have been written by anyone, not very official. I've read over and over again though about chlorophyll's positive effects on oxygen though. If anyone has any conflicting information or could confirm this, it may be an important part of a regimen. For me, I am going to start using it again.

tudor wrote:GoodThings ...how much iodine do you take?

i take about 20 vertical drops of the 2%.

For whatever reason I cannot find a chart that has been around for decades. The chart shows that using iodide (the reduced form of iodine with niacin) has a significant regression of atherosclerotic plaque that was shown on before and after photos of the retina.

"Over 30 years ago, two ophthalmologists observed that a combination tablet called Iodo-niacin (iodide 120 milligrams, niacin 15 milligrams) taken for several months could actually reverse atherosclerotic clogging of arteries. They proved this effect by taking pictures of clogged arteries in the backs of the eyes (retinal photomicrographs) before and after treatment. The published photographs showed a significant lessening of the artery clogging in the after pictures."

I've been using relatively large doses of iodine for years now. For more info on a related subject read this:
https://immortalhair.forumotion.com/t1129-hypothesis-of-male-pattern-hair-loss

In my experience, there is no doubt that iodine/iodide and its companion nutrients (co-factors) substantially boosts circulation and blood flow. Optimizing thyroid function is what delivers the oxygen (where it counts) to hair follicles.

hellwig asked:

Do you attribute feeling great to taking iodine?

I do.

I started taking high dose iodine (100+ mg/day) in December of 2011 on the advice of CS for fibroids, which my doctor seconded the recommendation. BTW, my primary care physician is a MD who is allopathically trained and can prescribe pharmaceuticals but who practices mostly natural therapies by choice. Her opinion: "I really like iodine."

The incidental and most beneficial effect of iodine has been on my well-being. I have never experienced such consistent beneficial effects on my mood and sleep with any other therapy, allopathic or natural. Probably the beneficial effect on my sleep is what stabilized my mood, but whatever the mechanism, I'll take it and don't ever want to go back to where I was before.

IMHO one reason iodine is able to sustain such a bad rap across the board is that if you're not fairly well cleaned out (chelated, good diet, etc.) it can make you feel worse. I first tried it last July or August (have to check old posts) and couldn't tolerate even 12.5mg/day of Iodoral tabs. I was jittery, extreme polyuria, etc. Wasn't sure at that time what was the problem, as I had started the whole IH regimen at the time, but I found after some experiementation that I could tolerate the IH regimen without iodine okay. So it was iodine that was the problem.

After two rounds of chelation and some concentrated effort on my diet, I was finally able to start high dose iodine in December with no problem. It's been all good since. Incidentally, I believe it's working on my fibroids, too, but I had to start actually applying iodine to my abdomen ("iodine painting") to see the most marked effects in a short amount of time. But time will tell. My condition is fairly advanced so knew it would be a hard slog when I started.

My main point: I DO attribute feeling great to iodine, and in largest measure to iodine. Had seen small incremental beneficial effects with other supplements and diet changes before it, but nothing so consistent and marked as with it. Especially on my sleep, which is the foundation of any good health.

CS where do you stand on the Peat claims of sugar being so crucial for thyroid function? I notice I do feel warmer when sugar is consumed, but not necessarily in a good way

Yanks - Regarding diet, I believe it comes down to metabolic typing.

For most people, having some form of sugar or at the very least a safe starch is important because thyroid
can slow down under a heavy ketogenic diet (however, the body can compensate for this in the longer term).

When under stress, cortisol can rise and eating sugar (in my view, preferably fructose) will help reduce cortisol and getting the best of both worlds (low insulin and low cortisol).

When consuming sugar in the presence of fat, the metabolics change. Consuming sugar in the presence of fat creates problems and they are probably much larger when that fat is oxidized, which all of the commercial (refined) oils are.

In any event, Ray Peat believes that PUFAS are worse than sugar. I think that's true. I would only argue that there are good PUFAS, such as unrefined (raw), non cooked, which are very good and do not cause oxidation.

Ray Peat's idea of ice cream with minimal ingredients is very appealing. I purchased some Trader's Joes chocolate ice cream, which contains four ingredients all together. I tolerated it very well. If were to eat Cold Stone or something like that, it would not work out so well.

Of course, not everyone can tolerate diary, regardless of quality.

Why I believe blood flow has so much to do with hair loss, is the connection with the pattern in MPB following closely to the layout of the veins on the scalp, this could also explain why families follow the same family pattern and why hair continues to grow on the sides and back of the head??? The picture below describes what I'm thinking/saying;

Scalp veins

There is not a doubt in my mind that hair loss is related to poor circulation. Like I said previously, when I shaved my head I felt the difference in tension in the balding parts of my scalp and also in the parts (1/2" over) that were still full and I found that the skin was much much tighter in the bald areas. After rubbing my head and massaging for 5-10 minutes the skin on top is almost as loose as the skin on the sides.
Thats why bald guys have a shiny scalp. Because its so tight. If you pinch the skin a little and loosen it up it will not be shiny any more; it will look like normal skin on which hair grows.
That tight skin is what impedes blood flow IMO.

SlowMoe wrote:There is not a doubt in my mind that hair loss is related to poor circulation. Like I said previously, when I shaved my head I felt the difference in tension in the balding parts of my scalp and also in the parts (1/2" over) that were still full and I found that the skin was much much tighter in the bald areas. After rubbing my head and massaging for 5-10 minutes the skin on top is almost as loose as the skin on the sides.
Thats why bald guys have a shiny scalp. Because its so tight. If you pinch the skin a little and loosen it up it will not be shiny any more; it will look like normal skin on which hair grows.
That tight skin is what impedes blood flow IMO.

You must be doing something right with your massages, I have my own way of scalp massages too, like working blood up from the eyebrows through the forehead and to the hairline, massaging blood up the posterior auricular and superficial temporal veins (behind and in front of the ears), safe tugging of the hair all over and lastly intense rubbing/massaging on certain areas...
I sometimes get the tingly feeling more than other times, so I don't fully understand what the best ways are;

* What techniques do you that you feel are the most productive?

* After you 10-15min massage, how long can you feel the tingly feeling for?

FATE? wrote:

SlowMoe wrote:There is not a doubt in my mind that hair loss is related to poor circulation. Like I said previously, when I shaved my head I felt the difference in tension in the balding parts of my scalp and also in the parts (1/2" over) that were still full and I found that the skin was much much tighter in the bald areas. After rubbing my head and massaging for 5-10 minutes the skin on top is almost as loose as the skin on the sides.
Thats why bald guys have a shiny scalp. Because its so tight. If you pinch the skin a little and loosen it up it will not be shiny any more; it will look like normal skin on which hair grows.
That tight skin is what impedes blood flow IMO.

You must be doing something right with your massages, I have my own way of scalp massages too, like working blood up from the eyebrows through the forehead and to the hairline, massaging blood up the posterior auricular and superficial temporal veins (behind and in front of the ears), safe tugging of the hair all over and lastly intense rubbing/massaging on certain areas...
I sometimes get the tingly feeling more than other times, so I don't fully understand what the best ways are;

* What techniques do you that you feel are the most productive?

* After you 10-15min massage, how long can you feel the tingly feeling for?

I just rub my hair with the top half of 3-4 fingers in 3-4" diameter cifcles starting at the hairline going back against the grain so I get the maximum stimulation of the scalp. I probably do it more like 30 minutes to an hour a day while driving home (it is an hour drive one way).

The tingly feeling is from the hair being so short; it really invigorates my scalp. If my hair were longer I wouldnt get the same tingly feeling....

Actually, let me re-iterate...

First I start off by placing my palm firmly on the back of my neck and rubbing towards the top of my head, kind of to "pull" blood from the base of my skull. I also to the same motion starting above my ears. I do this for 1-2 minutes.

Then I rub my head with the tips of all five fingers in a circular motion starting at the hairline working my way back, going against the grain. I continue until I feel that all of my hairs have been invigorated then I start over.

I also place my palm on the top of my head, with my palm on one side of the balding area and my fingertips on the other side, and then pull the two sides together firmly, which sort of wrinkles my head up; I hold for a couple seconds. I will start at the hairline and work my way back, relieving tension along the entire length of my balding region. I do this 2 or 3 times, and 2 or 3 times a day. I believe this stretches the muscles that pull down on the galea and cause the scalp to be really tight.

I think that the more attention you pay to rubbing and massaging your head, and returning the blood flow, the faster your hair will grow back.

I think I will keep my hair about 1/8" in length because when I rub it if feels soooooo invigorating.

Another factor is that due to my shorter hair my fitted cap doesnt fit so tight