Should we listen to Dr. Mercola and Weston A Price?

soccerguy Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:13 pm

well, Mercola is super bald so.....

nidhogge Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:31 pm

Mercola has addressed his baldness in the past, he wasn't always an alternative medicine guru. Not sure how Weston A. Price ate and led his lifestyle, but my guess is that it was a very "civilized" diet given the amount of wealth that he had.

CausticSymmetry Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:08 pm

Both already went bald before they understood what might be causing it. Dr. Mercola once followed all the politically correct guidelines, low fat, plenty of carbs and he rightly blames this type of food for his lack of hair.

ViolatedBird Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:21 am

So, high-carb low-fat (vegan) is bad? Is a high-protien, high-fat diet "good" for hair?

What type of diet do you recommend, CS?

I recall Dr. Mercloa's musings on the cause of his hair loss. He blames it on grain consumption. In his book, "The No Grain Diet", he postulates that if he were to have never eaten grain, he would have kept all of his hair.

I don't quite understand how grain would related to hair loss, specifically. If anyone here has a theory, I'd love to know about it.

mphatesmpb Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:47 am

I don't quite understand how grain would related to hair loss, specifically. If anyone here has a theory, I'd love to know about it.

There's a correlation between excess consumption of grains (especially refined grains) and insulin resistance. Something like 65% of the world population's calories now come from grains. Cultivation and processing of grains began only about 5,000 years ago, which is relatively recent considering the fact that the human genome has been in evolution for over 100,000 years. The paleo diet movement is based on the concept that the human species is not biologically "designed" to consume grains.

Mercola concludes that over-consumption of carbohydrates in general is the cause of insulin resistance, but I think there might be more to the story. I could be wrong, but I believe that there's something about grains themselves (and not other sources of carbohydrates) which promote insulin resistance.

Based on my limited knowledge, I believe that the problem with grains might involve their disruption of normal immune function. The lectins in grains (as well as seeds, nuts, legumes) have been linked to degradation of the intestinal mucusa, which is the root of the immune system. I am a bit hazy on this, but I believe that lectins might also cause leaky gut (maybe someone can confirm this). Leaky gut can lead to endotoxemia (excessive levels of liposaccharide released into circulation), and total disregulation of the immune system.

Keep in mind that there's an immune component in MPB. Several studies have shown that hair follicles in MPB-prone individuals are colonized by an inflammatory infiltrate of activated lymphocytes (white blood cells).

Phytates in grains also bind to trace nutrients in the intestinal lumen and prevent absorption, resulting in deficiencies.

Whole grains are a potent source of PUFA (usually omega-6), and there's plenty of information on this forum and elsewhere about the potential risks of over-consuming omega-6.

It can't just be that carbohydrates cause insulin resistance. Fruit, for example, are concentrated sources of monosaccharides (refined sugar), which are generally demonized as the cause of insulin resistance.

Espio Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:20 am

mphatesmpb wrote:

I don't quite understand how grain would related to hair loss, specifically. If anyone here has a theory, I'd love to know about it.

There's a correlation between excess consumption of grains (especially refined grains) and insulin resistance. Something like 65% of the world population's calories now come from grains. Cultivation and processing of grains began only about 5,000 years ago, which is relatively recent considering the fact that the human genome has been in evolution for over 100,000 years. The paleo diet movement is based on the concept that the human species is not biologically "designed" to consume grains.

Mercola concludes that over-consumption of carbohydrates in general is the cause of insulin resistance, but I think there might be more to the story. I could be wrong, but I believe that there's something about grains themselves (and not other sources of carbohydrates) which promote insulin resistance.

Based on my limited knowledge, I believe that the problem with grains might involve their disruption of normal immune function. The lectins in grains (as well as seeds, nuts, legumes) have been linked to degradation of the intestinal mucusa, which is the root of the immune system. I am a bit hazy on this, but I believe that lectins might also cause leaky gut (maybe someone can confirm this). Leaky gut can lead to endotoxemia (excessive levels of liposaccharide released into circulation), and total disregulation of the immune system.

Keep in mind that there's an immune component in MPB. Several studies have shown that hair follicles in MPB-prone individuals are colonized by an inflammatory infiltrate of activated lymphocytes (white blood cells).

Phytates in grains also bind to trace nutrients in the intestinal lumen and prevent absorption, resulting in deficiencies.

Whole grains are a potent source of PUFA (usually omega-6), and there's plenty of information on this forum and elsewhere about the potential risks of over-consuming omega-6.

It can't just be that carbohydrates cause insulin resistance. Fruit, for example, are concentrated sources of monosaccharides (refined sugar), which are generally demonized as the cause of insulin resistance.

LOL, it's funny how "natural health" people say grains cause insulin resistance, with no facts at all, all you can say is that "well man has only had agriculture for 5,000 years so our body hasn't evolved for it yet." That is not a fact, evolution is a theory, and archeology has well proven that we agriculture and civilization has been here for hundreds of thousands of years.

Let's look at real facts other than just this evolutionary mumbo-jumbo:

http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/5/965.short

Whole-grain intake and insulin sensitivity: the Insulin Resistance Atherosclerosis Study1,2,3
Angela D Liese, Amy K Roach, Karen C Sparks, Len Marquart, Ralph B D'Agostino Jr and Elizabeth J Mayer-Davis
1 From the Department of Epidemiology and Biostatistics, Arnold School of Public Health, University of South Carolina, Columbia (ADL, AKR, KCS, and EJM-D); the Department of Food Science and Nutrition, University of Minnesota, St Paul (LM); General Mills Inc, Minneapolis (LM); and Bowman Gray School of Medicine, Wake Forest University, Winston-Salem, NC (RBD).
Background: Increased intake of whole-grain foods has been related to a reduced risk of developing diabetes and heart disease. One underlying pathway for this relation may be increased insulin sensitivity.

Objective: We assessed the relation between dietary intake of whole grain-containing foods and insulin sensitivity (SI).

Design: We evaluated data from the Insulin Resistance Atherosclerosis Study (IRAS Exam I, 1992-1994). Usual dietary intakes in 978 middle-aged adults with normal (67%) or impaired (33%) glucose tolerance were ascertained by using an interviewer-administered, validated food-frequency questionnaire. Whole-grain intake (servings per day) was derived from dark breads and high-fiber and cooked cereals. SI was assessed by minimal model analyses of the frequently sampled intravenous-glucose-tolerance test. Fasting insulin was measured by using a radioimmunoassay. We modeled the relation of whole-grain intake to log(SI + 1) and to log(insulin) by using multivariable linear regression.

Results: On average, IRAS participants consumed 0.8 servings of whole grains/d. Whole-grain intake was significantly associated with SI (ß = 0.082, P = 0.0005) and insulin (ß = -0.0646, P = 0.019) after adjustment for demographics, total energy intake and expenditure, smoking, and family history of diabetes. The addition of body mass index and waist circumference attenuated but did not explain the association with SI. The addition of fiber and magnesium resulted in a nonsignificant association that is consistent with the hypothesis that these constituents account for some of the effect of whole grains on SI.

Conclusion: Higher intakes of whole grains were associated with increases in insulin sensitivity.

ViolatedBird Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:26 am

It can't just be that carbohydrates cause insulin resistance. Fruit, for example, are concentrated sources of monosaccharides (refined sugar), which are generally demonized as the cause of insulin resistance.

I agree with much of this. I'm certainly not a proponent of grains.

However, I've recently been somewhat swayed by Dr. Doug Graham's approach. His claim is that the consumption of fat is what increases insulin resistance. Adding carbohydrates and sugars (in any form) to a diet that is moderate-to-high in fat intake would thus be the recipe for insulin resistance.

It makes some sense, to me. A few of the Internet visible proponents of this approach often post their blood work online. They consume a diet focused on simple sugars and vegetables, keeping both fat and protein to a minimum. It would seem that their results match their theories -- that their bodies have no problem shuttling the sugars directly into cells where it is used. If sedentary, reduce calories. If active, increase calories. No changes in the P:F:C ratio are required.

The theory:
A healthy body is fully capable of handling large and continuous amounts of sugar with stable and small amounts of insulin. Every cell in the body runs on glucose. However, the ingestion of fatty foods and oils (even in amounts we would consider to be "moderate or low" ) hinders the action of insulin. Because of this, a diet that has any focused source of fat (even multiple avocados or small servings of meat per day) is going to be one that hinders the action of insulin enough that carbohydrates and simple sugars become harmful.

I'm still on the fence, myself. It would seem, based on studies, that the human body can thrive on EITHER option, but not when trying to mix-and-match with a "garbage can" diet (the SAD.)

The body can thrive on a high protein, high fat, high vegetable diet because there are few carbohydrates and therefore there is no interaction between fat and sugar. Insulin stays normalized. (High fat, low glucose.)

The body can also thrive on a high simple sugar, high vegetable, low fat diet, because there is only an essential intake of fat, and insulin is able to deal with the sugars and provide high amounts of energy without any problem. (Low fat, high glucose.)

The only thing the does NOT work: moderate fat + moderate glucose. One or the other has to be diminished in all of the "successful" diets that are currently popular, but more importantly -- in many repeated studies!

Between the two diets, it would seem that the "paleo" version is less suited for those participating in endurance sports. Most "paleo" books, especially those written for athletes, eventually admit to this concession -- that increased carbohydrates will be needed if one wishes to live a truly "athletic" lifestyle.

Espio Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:26 am

Furthermore, going back to the original poster's implied theory, about mercola and price being bald, yes it is an obvious assertion that people who eat high fat diets are more often bald than those who eat low fat diets. Look at all the people who promote vegetarian and vegan diets, very few of them are losing their hair. Yes you can always point at some bald vegans once in a while but it is obviously the exception.

Espio Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:36 am

A>R lifted the ban on me so I could say this information of enduring import

ubraj Fri Sep 02, 2011 8:57 am

FWIW, limiting fat will help keep biofilm in check.

Some have mentioned great results on another forum dedicated to serious autoimmune ailments by going ultra low fat diet.

But again, ultra low fat diet reducing hair loss IMO is a biofilm issue. There are other ways to reduce biofilm...

Note how many here mention yellow teeth or plaque on teeth or similar on this forum, which is biofilm.

hope this helps

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:41 am

mphatesmpb wrote:

I don't quite understand how grain would related to hair loss, specifically. If anyone here has a theory, I'd love to know about it.

There's a correlation between excess consumption of grains (especially refined grains) and insulin resistance. Something like 65% of the world population's calories now come from grains. Cultivation and processing of grains began only about 5,000 years ago, which is relatively recent considering the fact that the human genome has been in evolution for over 100,000 years. The paleo diet movement is based on the concept that the human species is not biologically "designed" to consume grains.

Mercola concludes that over-consumption of carbohydrates in general is the cause of insulin resistance, but I think there might be more to the story. I could be wrong, but I believe that there's something about grains themselves (and not other sources of carbohydrates) which promote insulin resistance.

Based on my limited knowledge, I believe that the problem with grains might involve their disruption of normal immune function. The lectins in grains (as well as seeds, nuts, legumes) have been linked to degradation of the intestinal mucusa, which is the root of the immune system. I am a bit hazy on this, but I believe that lectins might also cause leaky gut (maybe someone can confirm this). Leaky gut can lead to endotoxemia (excessive levels of liposaccharide released into circulation), and total disregulation of the immune system.

Keep in mind that there's an immune component in MPB. Several studies have shown that hair follicles in MPB-prone individuals are colonized by an inflammatory infiltrate of activated lymphocytes (white blood cells).

Phytates in grains also bind to trace nutrients in the intestinal lumen and prevent absorption, resulting in deficiencies.

Whole grains are a potent source of PUFA (usually omega-6), and there's plenty of information on this forum and elsewhere about the potential risks of over-consuming omega-6.

It can't just be that carbohydrates cause insulin resistance. Fruit, for example, are concentrated sources of monosaccharides (refined sugar), which are generally demonized as the cause of insulin resistance.

http://www.drfuhrman.com/
http://www.drmcdougall.com/
Asia pre 1970
More than half the world pre 1950.

Grains don't induce insulin resistance mp. Potentially, removal of grains may be beneficial once health has deteriorated. It's important to make this distinction.

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:18 pm

ViolatedBird wrote:
It can't just be that carbohydrates cause insulin resistance. Fruit, for example, are concentrated sources of monosaccharides (refined sugar), which are generally demonized as the cause of insulin resistance.

I agree with much of this. I'm certainly not a proponent of grains.

However, I've recently been somewhat swayed by Dr. Doug Graham's approach. His claim is that the consumption of fat is what increases insulin resistance. Adding carbohydrates and sugars (in any form) to a diet that is moderate-to-high in fat intake would thus be the recipe for insulin resistance.

It makes some sense, to me. A few of the Internet visible proponents of this approach often post their blood work online. They consume a diet focused on simple sugars and vegetables, keeping both fat and protein to a minimum. It would seem that their results match their theories -- that their bodies have no problem shuttling the sugars directly into cells where it is used. If sedentary, reduce calories. If active, increase calories. No changes in the P:F:C ratio are required.

The theory:
A healthy body is fully capable of handling large and continuous amounts of sugar with stable and small amounts of insulin. Every cell in the body runs on glucose. However, the ingestion of fatty foods and oils (even in amounts we would consider to be "moderate or low" ) hinders the action of insulin. Because of this, a diet that has any focused source of fat (even multiple avocados or small servings of meat per day) is going to be one that hinders the action of insulin enough that carbohydrates and simple sugars become harmful.

I'm still on the fence, myself. It would seem, based on studies, that the human body can thrive on EITHER option, but not when trying to mix-and-match with a "garbage can" diet (the SAD.)

The body can thrive on a high protein, high fat, high vegetable diet because there are few carbohydrates and therefore there is no interaction between fat and sugar. Insulin stays normalized. (High fat, low glucose.)

The body can also thrive on a high simple sugar, high vegetable, low fat diet, because there is only an essential intake of fat, and insulin is able to deal with the sugars and provide high amounts of energy without any problem. (Low fat, high glucose.)

The only thing the does NOT work: moderate fat + moderate glucose. One or the other has to be diminished in all of the "successful" diets that are currently popular, but more importantly -- in many repeated studies!

Between the two diets, it would seem that the "paleo" version is less suited for those participating in endurance sports. Most "paleo" books, especially those written for athletes, eventually admit to this concession -- that increased carbohydrates will be needed if one wishes to live a truly "athletic" lifestyle.

Please tell that to my 6pack.

ViolatedBird Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:23 pm

Please tell that to my 6pack.

Fair enough. What's your diet like? More importantly... how's your hair?

However, my assertions weren't meant to apply, at all, to weight-loss or adipose tissue. I'm talking about diets that provide optimum energy and disease resistance.

I know people with 6 packs that eat nothing but processed peanut butter on bagels and chicken breasts. It's not necessarily a marker of overall health.

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:27 pm

oirvblp wrote:FWIW, limiting fat will help keep biofilm in check.

Some have mentioned great results on another forum dedicated to serious autoimmune ailments by going ultra low fat diet.

But again, ultra low fat diet reducing hair loss IMO is a biofilm issue. There are other ways to reduce biofilm...

Note how many here mention yellow teeth or plaque on teeth or similar on this forum, which is biofilm.

hope this helps

It's because typically an ultra low fat diet always decreases pufa and therefore decreases inflammatory auto immune problems.

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:33 pm

ViolatedBird wrote:

Please tell that to my 6pack.

Fair enough. What's your diet like? More importantly... how's your hair?

50c30f20p hair loss halted.

However, my assertions weren't meant to apply, at all, to weight-loss or adipose tissue. I'm talking about diets that provide optimum energy and disease resistance.

Different macro nutrient profiles can have different therapeutic results but it's not an issue of finding some magic ratio that will prevent disease. There are plenty examples of high fat/high carb consuming hunter gather societies. High fat and high carb consumption is likely only a problem if the fat is from an excess of pufa. http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/glycemia.shtml

I know people with 6 packs that eat nothing but processed peanut butter on bagels and chicken breasts. It's not necessarily a marker of overall health.

Agreed, was just needling that one point.

tonyj Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:35 pm

...Whole-grain intake (servings per day) was derived from dark breads and high-fiber and cooked cereals....

The possibility is that the insoluble fiber "high fiber" modulates the absorption of carbohydrates and affect the glycemic response, reducing the spike in insulin levels, keeping insulin levels close to normal. So there are good carbs and bad carbs and the study is just further confirmation that the glycemic load of a carbohydrate is critical to keep your insulin levels from flying high after a high carbohydrate meal.

ViolatedBird Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:50 pm

50c30f20p hair loss halted.

What's in the 50c? Are you eating everything that is possible to digest -- or are you limiting your carbs to only starches or only fruits? Wheat? Rice and potatoes? Do you avoid gluten? What about eggs, dariy and fish?

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:07 pm

ViolatedBird wrote:
50c30f20p hair loss halted.

What's in the 50c? Are you eating everything that is possible to digest -- or are you limiting your carbs to only starches or only fruits? Wheat? Rice and potatoes? Do you avoid gluten? What about eggs, dariy and fish?

400g carbs. Fruit only. Some times I will and dairy.

Yes avoid gluten and all grains.

Eggs, whole milk, shellfish, organ meats.

mphatesmpb Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:27 pm

http://www.drfuhrman.com/
http://www.drmcdougall.com/
Asia pre 1970
More than half the world pre 1950.

Grains don't induce insulin resistance mp. Potentially, removal of grains may be beneficial once health has deteriorated. It's important to make this distinction.

abc123, what did you want me to look at from the linked web-pages?
What do you think causes the deterioration of health in the first place? PUFA?

abc123 Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:16 pm

mphatesmpb wrote:

http://www.drfuhrman.com/
http://www.drmcdougall.com/
Asia pre 1970
More than half the world pre 1950.

Grains don't induce insulin resistance mp. Potentially, removal of grains may be beneficial once health has deteriorated. It's important to make this distinction.

abc123, what did you want me to look at from the linked web-pages?
What do you think causes the deterioration of health in the first place? PUFA?

Just showing some doctors who reverse insulin resistance daily on high grain diets/anti-nutrient diets.

Multiple factors involved in every disease. If I had to pick I would say pufa, leaky gut and stress.

ubraj Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:02 pm

abc123 wrote:
It's because typically an ultra low fat diet always decreases pufa and therefore decreases inflammatory auto immune problems.

FWIW, wasn't meaning that. Here is some info what I mean

What I was meaning is biofilm is made up of calcium, magnesium, iron, fat, etc.. Reducing intake of fat will help here in a similar manner as chelating with EDTA (e.g. detoxamin) for biofilm issues.

A quote =

•He uses a McDougall low-fat diet with patients as biofilms have a fat component to them and eating fats, even healthy fats, may add to the problem of biofilms. The Swank MS low-fat diet may also be helpful.

•As you give more fatty acids, you increase the growth rate of the organism by 150 times. Organism likes fat and fat restriction may be a key to recovery. No meat, no cheese, no oils, no avocados, no nuts.

•Dr. Klinghardt suggested that liposomal artemisinin may be helpful here given that these microbes love fats...

•High protein diets are acidic and a disaster for people with Lyme disease. Stay away from fats.

http://www.betterhealthguy.com/joomla/blog/242-a-deep-look-beyond-lyme

Espio Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:17 pm

oirvblp wrote:FWIW, limiting fat will help keep biofilm in check.

Some have mentioned great results on another forum dedicated to serious autoimmune ailments by going ultra low fat diet.

But again, ultra low fat diet reducing hair loss IMO is a biofilm issue. There are other ways to reduce biofilm...

Note how many here mention yellow teeth or plaque on teeth or similar on this forum, which is biofilm.

hope this helps

OR receded gums right? I'm 27 years old but my gums are so receded that my teeth look as long as a 60 year old!

mphatesmpb Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:38 am

oirvblp wrote:FWIW, limiting fat will help keep biofilm in check.

Some have mentioned great results on another forum dedicated to serious autoimmune ailments by going ultra low fat diet.

But again, ultra low fat diet reducing hair loss IMO is a biofilm issue. There are other ways to reduce biofilm...

Note how many here mention yellow teeth or plaque on teeth or similar on this forum, which is biofilm.

hope this helps

Where do biofilms form besides the gut and mouth? It seems like any surface that is part of the digestive tract would be easier to rid of biofilms, since dietary approach can be used. But what about the others?

Columbo Sat Sep 03, 2011 3:10 am

abc123 wrote:

400g carbs. Fruit only. Some times I will and dairy.

400g carbs from fruit only? What's that, 15-20 pieces of fruit a day?!?

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