"How I Stopped Eating Food" - Very interesting project

What do you think of this? It sounds interesting...

Food is the fossil fuel of human energy. It is an enormous market full of waste, regulation, and biased allocation with serious geo-political implications. And we're deeply dependent on it. In some countries people are dying of obesity, others starvation. In my own life I resented the time, money, and effort the purchase, preparation, consumption, and clean-up of food was consuming. I am pretty young, generally in good health, and remain physically and mentally active. I don't want to lose weight. I want to maintain it and spend less energy getting energy.

I hypothesized that the body doesn't need food itself, merely the chemicals and elements it contains. So, I resolved to embark on an experiment. What if I consumed only the raw ingredients the body uses for energy? Would I be healthier or do we need all the other stuff that's in traditional food? If it does work, what would it feel like to have a perfectly balanced diet? I just want to be in good health and spend as little time and money on food as possible.

More info on - http://robrhinehart.com/?p=298

So he mixed some protein powder with olive oil and took a few vitamins/minerals. That's all you need to survive technically. Amino acids, fatty acids, vitamins and minerals with some antioxidants for good measure. You need zero carbs (he might have mixed some sugar in his concoction, who knows). Any way you slice it he's eating food and if anything it's taking more resources to process. Why eat olive oil and not just olives? Think about how many resources it takes to process olive oil. He must be getting amino acids from food as well and it's probably easier to just eat some beans or eggs rather than the highly processed powder from a factory burning fossil fuels. What he made is probably just a cheap version of what is in a feeding tube. I'm sure you can buy that stuff if you look around. Women put a tube in their nose with a regulated number of calories per day so they lose weight. It might be easier and cheaper for him and I think it might be a good idea if we humans developed some type of perfect food drink but it's not saving resources at all. I heard someone on Coast to Coast or somewhere who said they were abducted by aliens and their food was this light colored drink. It was probably just what they gave the alien astronauts to be efficient while they travel.

I dont think hes focusing on cutting down waste as such, just moving away from the obsession of food we have as a species in general. I agree with him, I hate preparing food and I get bored when im eating it, unless its tasty but that usually means its not all that healthy in my case. Id be tempted to try what hes done.

Hmm with all my stomach and digestion issues, I'm ready to try this. Think we could come up with a forum-approved recipe?

There is an ingredient spreadsheet from the Soylent forum here that we can use as a guide:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsrYTCyUkm3kdDZ0aGlULUlkSHEwQTd5ZDlLYm5YNUE#gid=0

Nuuu_Dx wrote:I dont think hes focusing on cutting down waste as such, just moving away from the obsession of food we have as a species in general. I agree with him, I hate preparing food and I get bored when im eating it, unless its tasty but that usually means its not all that healthy in my case. Id be tempted to try what hes done.

He's eating food and he's just paying someone else to process it. What he is doing takes a lot more resources for the earth than someone who buys fresh veggies and meats from a farmers market or local grocery store. The oil is from olives and the amino acids are from plants or animals and it's all sent to a factory to be processed.

thissucks wrote:Hmm with all my stomach and digestion issues, I'm ready to try this. Think we could come up with a forum-approved recipe?

There is an ingredient spreadsheet from the Soylent forum here that we can use as a guide:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsrYTCyUkm3kdDZ0aGlULUlkSHEwQTd5ZDlLYm5YNUE#gid=0

This stuff already exists. There is absolutely nothing original or creative about what he is doing. There are emergency food rations. There are meal replacement drinks. There are feeding tubes. The research he did consists of one wikipedia page...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_nutrient

Here are some medical foods that will eliminate any digestive issues...

http://www.metagenics.com/medical-foods

ngb wrote:

thissucks wrote:Hmm with all my stomach and digestion issues, I'm ready to try this. Think we could come up with a forum-approved recipe?

There is an ingredient spreadsheet from the Soylent forum here that we can use as a guide:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AsrYTCyUkm3kdDZ0aGlULUlkSHEwQTd5ZDlLYm5YNUE#gid=0

This stuff already exists. There is absolutely nothing original or creative about what he is doing. There are emergency food rations. There are meal replacement drinks. There are feeding tubes. The research he did consists of one wikipedia page...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_nutrient

Here are some medical foods that will eliminate any digestive issues...

http://www.metagenics.com/medical-foods

There is nothing original about what he is doing, but there is something very practical about it. Unfortunately, your link is only for practitioners. Elsewhere, I have viewed medical foods that cost about 3-5 times the amount of cash from what it will cost to make a similar sized portion of "Soylent." Why pay a huge premium for somebody else to make it for you, when you can make it at home for a reasonable cost?

You can buy it all on Amazon...

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=metagenics%20ultraclear&sprefix=metagenics+ultracl%2Caps&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Ametagenics%20ultraclear

Here are the ingredients...

[Other Ingredients: Rice protein concentrate
, rice syrup solids, magnesium citrate, olive oil, medium chain triglycerides, natural flavors, dipotassium phosphate, silica, d-alpha tocopheryl acetate, dicalcium phosphate, ascorbic acid, calcium citrate, L-glutamine, L-glycine, zinc gluconate, DL-methionine, L-lysine HCl, L-cysteine HCl, L-threonine, ferrous fumarate, niacinamide, copper gluconate, pyridoxine HCl
, D-calcium pantothenate, thiamin HCl, beta-carotene, riboflavin, chromium polynicotinate, retinyl palmitate, biotin, folic acid, potassium iodide, cyanocobalamin, and cholecalciferol

Directions: Blend, shake, or briskly stir 2 level scoops (44 grams) of UltraClear into 8 ounces of chilled water or juice twice daily, or as directed by your healthcare practitioner. For highly sensitive individuals, consider reducing consumption to 1/2 to 1 scoop with 4 to 5 ounces of chilled water or juice twice daily during the first 3 to 4 days before starting a full daily dose.

Warning: Excess vitamin A intake may be toxic and may increase the risk of birth defects. Pregnant women and women who may become pregnant should not exceed 5000 IU of preformed vitamin A (retinyl palmitate) per day.

Formulated to Exclude: Wheat, gluten, soy protein, egg, dairy products, nuts, tree nuts, fish, crustacean shellfish, colors, artificial sweeteners, and artificial flavors.]

Wow, what do you know, it's olive oil, rice protein and a bunch of vitamins and minerals. Exactly what he did. What is pissing me off is that this guy is trying to raise money on Kickstarter and had an article in Vice. He'll probably get enough idiots to donate and keep the money.

Hes just took something already known and introduced it to a wider market, good on him I say.

ngb wrote:You can buy it all on Amazon...

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=metagenics%20ultraclear&sprefix=metagenics+ultracl%2Caps&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Ametagenics%20ultraclear

Here are the ingredients...

[Other Ingredients: Rice protein concentrate
, rice syrup solids, magnesium citrate, olive oil, medium chain triglycerides, natural flavors, dipotassium phosphate, silica, d-alpha tocopheryl acetate, dicalcium phosphate, ascorbic acid, calcium citrate, L-glutamine, L-glycine, zinc gluconate, DL-methionine, L-lysine HCl, L-cysteine HCl, L-threonine, ferrous fumarate, niacinamide, copper gluconate, pyridoxine HCl
, D-calcium pantothenate, thiamin HCl, beta-carotene, riboflavin, chromium polynicotinate, retinyl palmitate, biotin, folic acid, potassium iodide, cyanocobalamin, and cholecalciferol

Directions: Blend, shake, or briskly stir 2 level scoops (44 grams) of UltraClear into 8 ounces of chilled water or juice twice daily, or as directed by your healthcare practitioner. For highly sensitive individuals, consider reducing consumption to 1/2 to 1 scoop with 4 to 5 ounces of chilled water or juice twice daily during the first 3 to 4 days before starting a full daily dose.

Warning: Excess vitamin A intake may be toxic and may increase the risk of birth defects. Pregnant women and women who may become pregnant should not exceed 5000 IU of preformed vitamin A (retinyl palmitate) per day.

Formulated to Exclude: Wheat, gluten, soy protein, egg, dairy products, nuts, tree nuts, fish, crustacean shellfish, colors, artificial sweeteners, and artificial flavors.]

Wow, what do you know, it's olive oil, rice protein and a bunch of vitamins and minerals. Exactly what he did. What is pissing me off is that this guy is trying to raise money on Kickstarter and had an article in Vice. He'll probably get enough idiots to donate and keep the money.

While I understand where you're coming from (and thanks for the link, the Metagenics stuff looks interesting), that medical food you linked is still rather expensive. Looks like about $70-$80 worth will last 10 days, so overall it will be over $200/month. Rob's mix currently cost him $150/month, so the price is potentially attractive. Also, if you make it yourself, you have control over all the ingredients. That Metagenics formula, for example, only provides 30g of protein a day under the suggested dose, while a Soylent mix can provide 50g/day. Rob has been constantly tweaking the formula to adjust to his own dietary needs. I think it's a great idea, especially since there is no "one size fits all" when it comes to nutrition.

With that being said, I may try the Metagenics stuff myself, and then try making a homemade mix to compare.

I just noticed that the Metagenics products seem to be more of a supplement than a full meal replacement. Just the fact that they suggest you can mix it with fruit juice makes me raise an eyebrow, as that's precisely one of the things I'm trying to avoid.

According to Rob's post from March: "My mixture now has 409g of carbohydrates, 65g of fat, and 102g of protein."

4 scoops of Metagenics, on the other hand, only has 38g of carbs, 10g of fat, and 30 g of protein.

Not really a comparison, eh?

Here are some other examples...

http://abbottnutrition.com/brands/products/osmolite-1_5-cal

http://www.nestlehealthscience.us/products/Pages/NUTREN%C2%AE-2-0.aspx

http://www.nestlehealthscience.us/products/Pages/PEPTAMEN-AF%C2%AE.aspx

If there is consumer demand for taking out corn syrup or soy protein then these companies can easily modify their formula (most people don't care). I've been putting olive oil in a protein shake and popping a vitamin/mineral supplement for 5 years which is basically what he's doing. I don't have a problem with him making his own formula. I have a problem with him asking for money from unsuspecting people who are ignorant about nutrition and medicine (not saying I'm an expert). You can get the list of essential nutrients from wikipedia, it's not exactly the Manhattan Project to buy everything on the list separately and mix it together.

Well he has put the ingredients up with the measurements. Nothing stopping people buying the stuff and making their own. I bet you will find the majority of people WANT him to produce it to sell just so they can buy the fnished product without doing the legwork themselves.

Nuuu_Dx wrote:Well he has put the ingredients up with the measurements. Nothing stopping people buying the stuff and making their own. I bet you will find the majority of people WANT him to produce it to sell just so they can buy the fnished product without doing the legwork themselves.

Maybe I am the only one who is in favour of him selling it as a finished product – the way I think about it is that our personal care products like Shampoo, Conditioner, Creams etc etc has the list of ingredients on it—how many of us read the ingredients list and go buy everything separately to create the same thing themselves ? or how many of people go in the wild to catch a wild pig so they can make a Boar brush instead of buying it in the store ?

I can’t wait till it’s available so I can buy it

I've decided to dive into this. Here are the main ingredients I'm planning on using:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015AQL1Q/ref=ox_ya_os_product
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/all-one-green-phyto-base-66-day-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUNRM/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003LPKETS/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-premium-pure-monosodium-phosphate-4-oz-113-grams-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015C2ZI2/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OSJ7S/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002S4PC3G/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title

I was also able to buy organic olive oil right at Walmart (hope it's good):
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Organic-Extra-Virgin-Olive-Oil/13448696

Although many people were using the Alive! liquid multivitamin, it contained preservatives. I was able to locate the All One vitamin source which is preservative free. My main caveat is that the maltodextrin is obviously from GMO corn.

There's organic maltodextrin here, but shipping is expensive: http://www.breworganic.com/organicmaltodextrin3lb.aspx

Thoughts?

thissucks wrote:I've decided to dive into this. Here are the main ingredients I'm planning on using:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015AQL1Q/ref=ox_ya_os_product
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/all-one-green-phyto-base-66-day-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUNRM/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003LPKETS/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-premium-pure-monosodium-phosphate-4-oz-113-grams-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015C2ZI2/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OSJ7S/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002S4PC3G/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title

I was also able to buy organic olive oil right at Walmart (hope it's good):
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Organic-Extra-Virgin-Olive-Oil/13448696

Although many people were using the Alive! liquid multivitamin, it contained preservatives. I was able to locate the All One vitamin source which is preservative free. My main caveat is that the maltodextrin is obviously from GMO corn.

There's organic maltodextrin here, but shipping is expensive: http://www.breworganic.com/organicmaltodextrin3lb.aspx

Thoughts?

They are called supplements for a reason. They aren't supposed to be your main source of nutrition. Bad idea. If you wanted to do something like this get your hands on medical feeding tube food since I trust the people who put that together (you know, people with actual degrees in medicine and nutrition).

ngb wrote:

thissucks wrote:I've decided to dive into this. Here are the main ingredients I'm planning on using:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015AQL1Q/ref=ox_ya_os_product
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/all-one-green-phyto-base-66-day-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUNRM/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003LPKETS/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-premium-pure-monosodium-phosphate-4-oz-113-grams-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015C2ZI2/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OSJ7S/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002S4PC3G/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title

I was also able to buy organic olive oil right at Walmart (hope it's good):
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Organic-Extra-Virgin-Olive-Oil/13448696

Although many people were using the Alive! liquid multivitamin, it contained preservatives. I was able to locate the All One vitamin source which is preservative free. My main caveat is that the maltodextrin is obviously from GMO corn.

There's organic maltodextrin here, but shipping is expensive: http://www.breworganic.com/organicmaltodextrin3lb.aspx

Thoughts?

They are called supplements for a reason. They aren't supposed to be your main source of nutrition. Bad idea. If you wanted to do something like this get your hands on medical feeding tube food since I trust the people who put that together (you know, people with actual degrees in medicine and nutrition).

Yes but as we've already gone over, all those products are terminally flawed. The latest round of your links all contained milk ingredients, GMO soy, GMO corn, triglycerides, carrageenan, etc. Not to mention they are overpriced. Those people may have degrees in nutrition, but $$$ is the bottom line and they are clearly not using the best ingredients.

The way I look at it, I can either make it myself, or not do it at all. And I'm willing to try it. I don't plan on this sticking with this diet long term, except perhaps on a more supplementary basis (as you suggest), but I'm interested to see if perhaps a few months of this stuff can assist in healing my gut.

thissucks wrote:

ngb wrote:

thissucks wrote:I've decided to dive into this. Here are the main ingredients I'm planning on using:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015AQL1Q/ref=ox_ya_os_product
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/all-one-green-phyto-base-66-day-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OUNRM/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003LPKETS/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-premium-pure-monosodium-phosphate-4-oz-113-grams-pwdr
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0015C2ZI2/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013OSJ7S/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002S4PC3G/ref=rcxsubs_mys2_product_title

I was also able to buy organic olive oil right at Walmart (hope it's good):
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Organic-Extra-Virgin-Olive-Oil/13448696

Although many people were using the Alive! liquid multivitamin, it contained preservatives. I was able to locate the All One vitamin source which is preservative free. My main caveat is that the maltodextrin is obviously from GMO corn.

There's organic maltodextrin here, but shipping is expensive: http://www.breworganic.com/organicmaltodextrin3lb.aspx

Thoughts?

They are called supplements for a reason. They aren't supposed to be your main source of nutrition. Bad idea. If you wanted to do something like this get your hands on medical feeding tube food since I trust the people who put that together (you know, people with actual degrees in medicine and nutrition).

Yes but as we've already gone over, all those products are terminally flawed. The latest round of your links all contained milk ingredients, GMO soy, GMO corn, triglycerides, carrageenan, etc. Not to mention they are overpriced. Those people may have degrees in nutrition, but $$$ is the bottom line and they are clearly not using the best ingredients.

The way I look at it, I can either make it myself, or not do it at all. And I'm willing to try it. I don't plan on this sticking with this diet long term, except perhaps on a more supplementary basis (as you suggest), but I'm interested to see if perhaps a few months of this stuff can assist in healing my gut.

You have a much better chance of doing great damage to your body trying to mix up a bunch of powders than eating GMO corn or soy. If you gave me a choice to eat a liquid meal replacement that included GMO corn vs. a homemade concoction of powders from god knows where I would take the meal replacement that keeps people alive in comas for decades. There are plenty of meal replacements that eliminate corn, soy and milk. I'm not an expert on feeding tube food, I just posted a few links. Abbott is an American company. Nestle is from Switzerland. I'm sure they have European versions of their products that avoid GMO corn, soy and milk.

I understand from the prespective of an incredibly busy person, but eating food is a part of life and should be enjoyed?

Also, you are not going to live forever. Good on you for making healthy choices but there is no failsafe, all living must one day die. You can prolong you life, but I think this is too much. This smacks me as something somebody who is trying to live for another 300 years would do.

fumanchu wrote:I understand from the prespective of an incredibly busy person, but eating food is a part of life and should be enjoyed?

Also, you are not going to live forever. Good on you for making healthy choices but there is no failsafe, all living must one day die. You can prolong you life, but I think this is too much. This smacks me as something somebody who is trying to live for another 300 years would do.

Normally, yes. But for someone with digestion problems like me, eating food leads to discomfort and often is more trouble than it's worth. Because of this, I tend to prefer to drink my meals.

And for the record, yes I have PFS. I'm sure I can thank Propecia for all this. I used to be normal before I took that rat posion.

I'm starting this tomorrow. Anybody else interested?

There's a ginormous thread debating the ingredients of Soylent, here:
http://robrhinehart.com/?p=424

I made a few posts. In one, I quoted the Soylent creator's statement:

"Yep, it’s just whey, though I buy a really cheap brand to lower cost."

And replied:

Good job. Lower cost, lower quality.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/10/23/ori-hofmekler-on-whey-protein.aspx

Whey Isolate

There are a number of whey products on the market, but unfortunately many of them will not give you the health benefits associated with high-quality whey.

Most commercial whey products are derived from pasteurized dairy and are processed with heat and acid. Many are also artificially sweetened. All of these factors render them completely useless from a health perspective.

Whey isolate is one such inferior product, because when you remove the fat, you actually remove important components of itsimmunological properties, such as phospholipids, phosphatidylserine and cortisol.

Additionally, all of the IgG immunoglobulins, which are an excellent source of glutamine and cysteine, are also bound to the fat globule. Fat provides not just calories. In fact, most food rich in healthful fat, including nuts, seeds, chia and almonds are carriers of antioxidants, such as vitamin E and phytosterols.

Dairy also contains lipoic acid, which is a carrier of enzymes and immunoglobulin.

Therefore, if you take the fat out you're left with a clearly inferior whey protein.

"I'm totally against whey isolate," Ori says. "I think it's just the wrong whey."

A couple other issues are: doesn't provide omega 3's, uses unfermented soy.

Could you not swap whey protein for hemp protein?

As I understand, Soylent comes read-made. Of course one could come up with their own concoction, and I'm sure that would be better.

Nuuu_Dx wrote:Could you not swap whey protein for hemp protein?

I've been making my own Soylent, and I'm really pleased so far. It is very easy on the digestion, and I don't get any scalp itching either. I haven't switched all the way over to it though, it currently composes about 50% of my diet. I'm going to ramp it up more and more until I'm on soylent 100% and try that for a few weeks.