Is treating environmental issues enough to reverse hairloss?

SlowMoe Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:54 am

Before I get into my theory:

I agree with most on this forum, that there are several factors involved in hairloss. I think that for optimum hair health, and health in general, we need to live a healthy lifestyle, adress mineral deficiencies, toxins ect. And as far as that goes I probably don't know half as much about health in general as most on here. With that said, I do not feel that enough emphasis is given to environmental issues. I feel as though environmental issues may be a large part of the MPB puzzle, if not the majority.

By environmental issues, I am speciffically talking about the integrity of the vascular system and overall health of your scalp.

In a thread I posted recently, it became fairly clear that the reason we bald on the top of our heads, and not anywhere else on our body, is because the vascular system on balding scalps have been compromised by poor overall bloodflow to the head, tight skin on the tops of our heads due to skull size and shape and also stress, which tenses up scalp muscles and causes the skin to become like a snare drum in tightness, in some cases.

Now if you look at the most unhealthy, most bald people out there, and guess what; most of them still have a full mane of hair on the sides and back. Obviously they have all the classic MPB symptoms, including inflammation, possible heavy metal toxicity, thyroid issues, you name it. Butcher they still have good hair on the sides and back.

What I am getting at, is in my belief, all the aspects of hair loss related to poor health, such as heavy metals, thyroid, gut ect... are a problem that is downstream of deterioration of the scalp vascular system.

Looking back at my other topic we found that the initial culprit in deterioration of the top of the scalp where we bald, is the low oxygen environment that develops prior to hairloss. A study was posted measuring the oxygen levels of scalp tissues in men with and without hair loss. The following approximated numbers were found, expressed in oxygen partial pressure

MPB balding areas 33
MPB non balding areas 51

Non MPB balding areas 53
Non MPB non balding 63

Looking at the non balding subjects, the oxygen content of the top of the scalp where balding typically takes place is approximately 20% lower than the sides. Now usingvthe same 20% drop in the balding subjects, we should have roughly a measure of 41 as a baseline oxygen level in the top of the scalp, in those balding. I assume that the 33 figure is due to the additional inflammation and tight scalp of those with MPB.

Soooooo, based in that, and the fact that DHT becomes a problem under low oxygen conditions only, i am goingbto assume that below oxygen levels of approximately 50, you start having problems with DHT, inflammation, toxin accumulation and sensitivity to issues such as those listed above; thyroid, gut, metals etc.

What I am really getting at, is that I believe the root of the problem is the poor oxygen environment created by poor circulation, and stress. I know that this is going to chap a lot of peoples ass, but I feel as though it's hard to deny that environmental issues need to be emphasized just as much as other problems. That is just my opinion.

I believe that improving your scalp environment by boosting oxygen content via stimulating blood flow will stop and reverse hairloss in many instances, by minimizing DHT sensitivity, engulfing pathogens with oxygen, and flushing cellular waste.

Now I realize this is more of a health forum than a hair forum, so please don't feel like I'm saying that being proative about your health is pointless, but I just feel that, especially for those in the early stages of hair loss, that their main focus should be fixing the environmental issues, because without those issues, the nutritional deficiencies would not have manifested as hair loss. What makes me so sure? The fact that if your deficiencies were the root cause, the sides if your head would have been losing hair to; the only difference is the typical MPB galea region has less oxygen, not enough to sustain hair growth.

I feel that keeping the oxygen levels at the top of the scalp at around 50 or more is the key to beating hairless; in the early stages it may be easy to do, maybe simply massaging the sides of your head and brushing, because the
Vascular system is still mostly intact and capable of supporting the bloodflow requirements. More advanced balding nay require a more aggressive approach, utilizing anti inflammatories, chelation and a more aggressive form of angiogenesis to get the vascular system back in shape.

moby Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:30 am

why aren't women suffering from this circulation issue then?

987 Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:06 am

moby wrote:why aren't women suffering from this circulation issue then?

It is likely that amongst many of the things discussed (i.e. nutritional deficiencies, poor oxygenation, thyroid health, low T to dht ratio, hormonal imbalances,shbg) on this forum seem to cause over sensitivity to dht, as well as upregulation and increased AR activity. Its probably simple as that, so men who generally have low free circulating androgens, and/or those who have more ideal hormonal ratios (T>Dht) seem to get by for a very long time without mpb occurrences.. As for women, they are generally out of harms way with the dht part of the equation; so all of their health flaws can go unnoticed in regards to hair. Estrogens apparently have an opposite effect as androgens in scalp tissue, especially in regards to inflammation and micro capillaries, so their hair loss seems to be easier to recover from as well... Simply put due to the hormonal differences in men and women ,women will always have much more leeway in keeping their hair under poor health conditions than most men, BUT when their hormones loose their protective youthful profile (i.e. post menopause) or under severely poor health, they loose hair from the galea as well.

http://pharmrev.aspetjournals.org/content/56/4/549.full

CausticSymmetry Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:08 pm

Many of these questions have been examined quite a number of times here over the years.

I will try to simplify the problem.

Is low oxygen a factor? Yes

Why? Low thyroid equals infection, infection equals inflammation, and inflammation equals low oxygen.

Why usually men and not women? As pointed out earlier, estrogen, which is higher in women will protect
against DHT and other factors, exception for those women with PCOS, who produce a large amount of androgens.

Amaranthaceae Tue Jul 24, 2012 4:51 pm

Why would an infection only spread to the MPB areas, why not to the lower parts of
the head?

The theory of a tight galea as the cause of low oxygen and infection is the only, the simplest answer so far.

CausticSymmetry wrote:Many of these questions have been examined quite a number of times here over the years.

I will try to simplify the problem.

Is low oxygen a factor? Yes

Why? Low thyroid equals infection, infection equals inflammation, and inflammation equals low oxygen.

Why usually men and not women? As pointed out earlier, estrogen, which is higher in women will protect
against DHT and other factors, exception for those women with PCOS, who produce a large amount of androgens.

ubraj Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:22 pm

cpio wrote:
Why would an infection only spread to the MPB areas, why not to the lower parts of
the head?

It's well known specific pathogens target specific areas of the body.

For example, regarding hair loss, there have been studies done showing specific pathogens associated with androgenic areata which have been posted on this site. And while there haven't been studies done showing if there has been increased hair growth after treating for those specific pathogens it would sound plausible.

And while there haven't been any studies on androgenic alopecia, independent researchers have found other pathogens connected with androgenic alopecia such as Dr. Sutherland. Dr. Sutherland originally found this one. While treating his son for it, his hair loss stopped. The frequency set was later expanded upon with research found from the internet by newport and theorized it was this specific virus that was found. "This virus (Dicistroviridae or Silkworm virus) infects certain soft tissue; heart valve, penis, scalp, larinx, soft tissue of knee, urogenital lining, more..."

Other researchers have used others as well and found improvement with their battle in fighting hair loss. Most of the original ones don't appear to visit this forum anymore or rarely do.

But as has been mentionedi in the past, what keeps most people with hair loss scratching their heads wondering what's going on is biofilm. Pathogens hide out in biofilm and are also hidden behind heavy metals such as mercury and lead. There has been a study posted here before showing that eradication of specific pathogens with antibiotics is not possible unless proper chelation is done. That the specific pathogen regrows and dominates again if chelation of mercury and lead is not done. But once the chelation is done, antibiotics are able to inhibit the pathogens enough where they do not return "long term."

Probably the easiest way to find which pathogens are associated with androgenic alopecia from an independent researchers point of view is to use a F-Scan. Unfortanately they do cost $3,500 but they've been used for many other ailments to help tell which frequencies and possibly which pathogens are associated with different ailments. It will also say which heavy metals also found through resonance. Like the tricorder on Star Trek. That use of the device has been shown to work well for many ailments that are pathogen involved. It's a legit device and if I'm not mistaken Switzerland has spent many millions in their own research with the device.

The F-Scan is used by Dr. Sutherland and most likely used and with other methods to find that specific pathogen connected with hair loss.

This and much more interesting info has been posted in the past on this forum. Most of it about 1 - 2 years ago.

I'm rusty on this one as it's been about two years but from memory it goes something like it's known when the body is no longer able to control an infection and thus inflammation is a constant presence, the body turns toward calcification as a final effort to try to limit the pathogen from spreading. Prague has commented years ago and if I'm not mistaken goes something like all treatments that work for hair loss also work via preventing calcification... including inhibiting DHT.

There was a study that I had to pay for a couple years ago titled Calcification of the Ivory Dome. In it, it found through autopsies that those with hair loss had increased calcification at the scalp and thus blood flow was reduced as an effect. The worse the hair loss the worse the calcification and thus less blood flow.

The conclusion appeared to suggest that blood flow as an effect of what was going on. That calcification is what was causing the reduced blood flow. That appears to suggest without getting a handle on calcification and finding the cause of the calcification that blood flow will continue to be reduced.

I believe that "Calcification of the Ivory Dome" is caused by "specific" pathogens. Just as there are specific pathogens found in heart disease. Just as there as specific pathogens associated with cancer. Just as there are specific pathogens associated with Parkinson's, etc.. This would also include mold.

There is pleomorphism which means how pathogens are able to shape shift so would want to get a good handle on the terrain to help prevent other ailments. CS talks about thyroid and that's important as the thyroid is greatly important for keeping the cells voltage up to prevent toxins and heavy metals from accumulating and from a good portion of pathogens from taking hold as well as other benefits of course.

hope this helps

Amaranthaceae Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:15 pm

Rdkml - Thanks for your reply. I think we are many who keep in mind the question regarding calcification, biofilm and pathogens in scalp tissue. But there is a much simpler explanation which is the tightening of the muscles (frontalis, temporalis, octopalis) that strap the galea ontop of the scalp. With diminished blood the immunesystem will be compromised, and pathogens become invasive. When blood is restored they disappear without treatment.
This theory must be tested.

SlowMoe Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:55 pm

cpio wrote:
Rdkml - Thanks for your reply. I think we are many who keep in mind the question regarding calcification, biofilm and pathogens in scalp tissue. But there is a much simpler explanation which is the tightening of the muscles (frontalis, temporalis, octopalis) that strap the galea ontop of the scalp. With diminished blood the immunesystem will be compromised, and pathogens become invasive. When blood is restored they disappear without treatment.
This theory must be tested.

This experiment produces a simple increase in blood flow via reduced scalp tension.

SlowMoe wrote:Treatment of Male Pattern Baldness with Botulinum Toxin: A Pilot Study
Freund, Brian J. D.D.S., M.D.; Schwartz, Marvin D.D.S., M.Sc.

Plastic and Reconstructive Surgery . 126(5):246e-248e, November 2010.
doi: 10.1097/PRS.0b013e3181ef816d

Author Information

Crown Institute; Pickering, Ontario, Canada

Correspondence to Dr. Freund, 49 Main Street South, Uxbridge, Ontario L9P 1J4, Canada, freund@crowninstitute.com

This clinical trial has been registered as “Treatment of Male Pattern Baldness with Botulinum Toxin” at http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ClinicalTrials.gov with identifier NCT00965640.

Article Outline | Back to Top
Sir:

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We would like to present the results of an open-label pilot study using botulinum toxin type A (Botox; Allergan, Inc., Irvine, Calif.) for the treatment of androgenetic alopecia. This form of alopecia is believed to be caused by a genetically predisposed sensitivity of hair follicles to the toxic effects of dihydrotestosterone, a metabolite of testosterone. Medical treatment of androgenetic alopecia has previously only been moderately effective using systemic drugs such as finasteride, a 5α-reductase inhibitor.1

In this ethically approved study, 50 male subjects aged between 19 and 57 years with Norwood/Hamilton ratings of II to IV participated.2 The study was 60 weeks in duration, with 12 weeks of run-in followed by two treatment cycles of 24 weeks each. Subjects were injected with 150 units of Botox (5 units per 0.1 ml saline) into the muscles surrounding the scalp, including frontalis, temporalis, periauricular, and occipitalis muscles in equally divided doses over 30 injection sites. The primary outcome measure was a change in hair count in a fixed 2-cm area using a method described by Canfield.3 Secondary outcome measures included hair loss, measured by having subjects collect loose hair from their pillow with a sticky lint roller, and subjective efficacy using a validated questionnaire. Statistical analysis entailed paired t tests of group means.

Forty subjects completed the study, and no adverse effects were reported. The treatment response rate was 75 percent. Mean hair counts for the entire group showed a statistically significant (p < 0.0001) increase of 18 percent between baseline and week 48 (Table 1), similar to the results reported with Propecia (Merck, Whitehouse Station, N.J.).1 Hair regrowth was objectively visible in some subjects (Fig. 1). Secondary outcome measures were also significantly improved. The reduction in hair loss and increase in hair count did not show a statistically significant correlation. This suggested that longer retention of terminal hairs did not account for the increase in hair count.

View Larger

View Larger

Mechanistically, the scalp behaves like a drum skin with tensioning muscles around the periphery. These muscle groups—the frontalis, occipitalis, and periauricular muscles and to a minor degree the temporalis—can create a “tight” scalp when chronically active. Because the blood supply to the scalp enters through the periphery, a reduction in blood flow would be most apparent at the distal ends of the vessels, specifically, the vertex and frontal peaks. Areas of the scalp with sparse hair growth have been shown to be relatively hypoxic, have slow capillary refill, and to have high levels of dihydrotestosterone.4

Conceptually, Botox “loosens” the scalp, reducing pressure on the perforating vasculature, thereby increasing blood flow and oxygen concentration. The enzymatic conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone is oxygen dependent. In low-oxygen environments, the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone is favored; whereas in high-oxygen environments, more testosterone is converted to estradiol.4 Blood flow may therefore be a primary determinant in follicular health. Strategically placed Botox injections appear able to indirectly modify this variable, resulting in reduced hair loss and new hair growth in some men with androgenetic alopecia.[/color]

ubraj Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:07 am

For what it's worth, only a percentage of pathogens are sensitive to oxygen. I know a lot of the nasty ones, such as the ones causing Vitamin D dysfunction like l form bacteria which is common in autoimmune ailments (two l form pathogens which are said to be implicated in MPB) are not sensitive to oxygen. Not to mention viruses of which at least one has been implicated in MPB.

When talking of blood circulation in fighting hair loss, IMO, the majority of the benefit is not due to the blood circulation but due to increased lymphatic circulation instead.

The lymph is much more important in MPB than blood circulation IMO. The lymph carries the toxins out of the area. What's important about this is a lot of what's a problem with so many ailments including hair loss IMO is it's shown it's the immune response and also the toxins that come off the pathogens and not the pathogens so much themselves that cause the problems in these autoimmune ailments.

A lot of interesting info on the lymph but take one example of how a pigs heart was able to beat for 3 1/2 years with nothing other than nutrients and removal of the waste. If the waste is not removed, then problems arise.

Can even test this out on own by doing methods that increase lymphatic system rather than blood circulation and vice versa. I am able to do this with my electrical devices and have my own observations years ago.

Recharging the cells such as what the thyroid is very helpful for is interesting in that one can take blood under a microscope and it will die within 3 - 4 days. But if one supplies an electrical charge to it, the blood will die in about 30 days. Pulsing electricity and magnetic fields recharges cells temporarily.

As well as surprised that stopping inflammation does not do a whole lot for hair loss by itself which IMO shows inflammation is an effect of what's going on rather than a direct cause. And interestingly the immune system uses inflammation/oxidation to fight a pathogen problem which is common in other ailments as well.

Anyhow, my point being is I really believe it's the lymphatic system being more responsible than the increased circulation in MPB. That when people are noticing benefits, it's due to this as it's responsible for carrying away the toxins. With an impaired lymph, besides other problems it creates, the immune response to the toxins and toxins from the pathogens will be much greater.

hope this helps

slowMoe,

Yes, the study was posted back in the days at regrowth with a lot of us trying an extra large blood pressure cuff placed around the forehead (Occlusion Training), pinching the forehead and balding areas extremely hard, wounding (which also increases blood circulation via new blood vessels and other benefits). Not to mention LLLT is one of the best ways for increased blood circulation as if I'm not mistaken a study found it dilates the blood vessels 200 - 300% and the vessels stay dilated 2 - 3 days from just one application. LLLT will also create new blood vessels and other benefits.

Inclined bed therapy would be extremely important for circulation FWIW but I don't believe it's been tried by someone with active hair loss.

I'm not trying to dismiss the blood circulation part of but only trying to say that I believe the benefits that people talk about are mostly due to the improved lymphatic drainage.

987 Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:42 am

rdkml wrote:For what it's worth, only a percentage of pathogens are sensitive to oxygen. I know a lot of the nasty ones, such as the ones causing Vitamin D dysfunction like l form bacteria which is common in autoimmune ailments (two l form pathogens which are said to be implicated in MPB) are not sensitive to oxygen. Not to mention viruses of which at least one has been implicated in MPB.

When talking of blood circulation in fighting hair loss, IMO, the majority of the benefit is not due to the blood circulation but due to increased lymphatic circulation instead.

The lymph is much more important in MPB than blood circulation IMO. The lymph carries the toxins out of the area. What's important about this is a lot of what's a problem with so many ailments including hair loss IMO is it's shown it's the immune response and also the toxins that come off the pathogens and not the pathogens so much themselves that cause the problems in these autoimmune ailments.

A lot of interesting info on the lymph but take one example of how a pigs heart was able to beat for 3 1/2 years with nothing other than nutrients and removal of the waste. If the waste is not removed, then problems arise.

Can even test this out on own by doing methods that increase lymphatic system rather than blood circulation and vice versa. I am able to do this with my electrical devices and have my own observations years ago.

Recharging the cells such as what the thyroid is very helpful for is interesting in that one can take blood under a microscope and it will die within 3 - 4 days. But if one supplies an electrical charge to it, the blood will die in about 30 days. Pulsing electricity and magnetic fields recharges cells temporarily.

As well as surprised that stopping inflammation does not do a whole lot for hair loss by itself which IMO shows inflammation is an effect of what's going on rather than a direct cause. And interestingly the immune system uses inflammation/oxidation to fight a pathogen problem which is common in other ailments as well.

Anyhow, my point being is I really believe it's the lymphatic system being more responsible than the increased circulation in MPB. That when people are noticing benefits, it's due to this as it's responsible for carrying away the toxins. With an impaired lymph, besides other problems it creates, the immune response to the toxins and toxins from the pathogens will be much greater.

hope this helps

slowMoe,

Yes, the study was posted back in the days at regrowth with a lot of us trying an extra large blood pressure cuff placed around the forehead (Occlusion Training), pinching the forehead and balding areas extremely hard, wounding (which also increases blood circulation via new blood vessels and other benefits). Not to mention LLLT is one of the best ways for increased blood circulation as if I'm not mistaken a study found it dilates the blood vessels 200 - 300% and the vessels stay dilated 2 - 3 days from just one application. LLLT will also create new blood vessels and other benefits.

Inclined bed therapy would be extremely important for circulation FWIW but I don't believe it's been tried by someone with active hair loss.

I'm not trying to dismiss the blood circulation part of but only trying to say that I believe the benefits that people talk about are mostly due to the improved lymphatic drainage.

I think you have a point to a lot of what you are saying, could definitely be true, but were I'll disagree;stopping inflammation for me was all that was needed so far in stopping my shedding and haven't shed since, although everything with hair loss is case by case.. Inclined bed therapy? I have been doing that for past month, raising foot of bed 4inches or so, cant tell much difference because my hair density is pretty full except for a couple thinned spots in the front, but I did see a similar thread recently pop up about it, but no one was talking about it in regards to lymphatic drainage...

Yanks Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:13 am

what rdkml was talking about in regard to inclined bed therapy was raising the head of the bed and not the foot of the bed. FRom the link that was posted in that original thread, it appears that minerals are held in the bladder when sleeping with the head below the feet. Therefore I suppose it could result in things like kidney stones and poor elimination of oxidized minerals and other toxins.

This is what I took from my skim through the link at least. Correct me if I'm wrong JDP

SlowMoe Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:27 am

rdkml wrote:For what it's worth, only a percentage of pathogens are sensitive to oxygen. I know a lot of the nasty ones, such as the ones causing Vitamin D dysfunction like l form bacteria which is common in autoimmune ailments (two l form pathogens which are said to be implicated in MPB) are not sensitive to oxygen. Not to mention viruses of which at least one has been implicated in MPB.

When talking of blood circulation in fighting hair loss, IMO, the majority of the benefit is not due to the blood circulation but due to increased lymphatic circulation instead.

It makes sense to me that lymphatic drainage could be equally important as actually oxygenating the tissue. I think it is hard to deny, however that since DHT is oxygen sensitive, the decreased androgen activity is likely a large factor, even if tge pathogens were not oxygen sensitive, which with my limited knowledge they tend to be.

The lymph is much more important in MPB than blood circulation IMO.

Increasing blood circulation increases is how you stimulate lymphatic flow, correct?

The lymph carries the toxins out of the area. What's important about this is a lot of what's a problem with so many ailments including hair loss IMO is it's shown it's the immune response and also the toxins that come off the pathogens and not the pathogens so much themselves that cause the problems in these autoimmune ailments.

A lot of interesting info on the lymph but take one example of how a pigs heart was able to beat for 3 1/2 years with nothing other than nutrients and removal of the waste. If the waste is not removed, then problems arise.

Can even test this out on own by doing methods that increase lymphatic system rather than blood circulation and vice versa. I am able to do this with my electrical devices and have my own observations years ago.

Recharging the cells such as what the thyroid is very helpful for is interesting in that one can take blood under a microscope and it will die within 3 - 4 days. But if one supplies an electrical charge to it, the blood will die in about 30 days. Pulsing electricity and magnetic fields recharges cells temporarily.

As well as surprised that stopping inflammation does not do a whole lot for hair loss by itself which IMO shows inflammation is an effect of what's going on rather than a direct cause.

That is why I feel so strongly that increasing blood flow is such an important aspect of hair loss. I have seen enough cases of hairloss being reversed simply by increasing blood flow, to believe that it is a major factor.

And interestingly the immune system uses inflammation/oxidation to fight a pathogen problem which is common in other ailments as well.

Anyhow, my point being is I really believe it's the lymphatic system being more responsible than the increased circulation in MPB. That when people are noticing benefits, it's due to this as it's responsible for carrying away the toxins. With an impaired lymph, besides other problems it creates, the immune response to the toxins and toxins from the pathogens will be much greater.

Yeah but it's hard to discredit the fact that oxygenation of the tissues via increased blood flow could potentially play a major role by decreasing androgen sensitivity. The fact that women have the same lymphatic drainage and pathogenic issues as us, and the fact that our domes go shiny bald attests to the effect of androgens.

hope this helps

slowMoe,

Yes, the study was posted back in the days at regrowth with a lot of us trying an extra large blood pressure cuff placed around the forehead (Occlusion Training), pinching the forehead and balding areas extremely hard, wounding (which also increases blood circulation via new blood vessels and other benefits). Not to mention LLLT is one of the best ways for increased blood circulation as if I'm not mistaken a study found it dilates the blood vessels 200 - 300% and the vessels stay dilated 2 - 3 days from just one application. LLLT will also create new blood vessels and other benefits.

Inclined bed therapy would be extremely important for circulation FWIW but I don't believe it's been tried by someone with active hair loss.

I'm not trying to dismiss the blood circulation part of but only trying to say that I believe the benefits that people talk about are mostly due to the improved lymphatic drainage.

987 Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:49 am

Yanks wrote:what rdkml was talking about in regard to inclined bed therapy was raising the head of the bed and not the foot of the bed. FRom the link that was posted in that original thread, it appears that minerals are held in the bladder when sleeping with the head below the feet. Therefore I suppose it could result in things like kidney stones and poor elimination of oxidized minerals and other toxins.

This is what I took from my skim through the link at least. Correct me if I'm wrong JDP

Maybe, but doesn't make much sense to me considering we spend 15+ hours up right. If people are spending time to do head/hand stands and inversion tables, I don't see why this isn't beneficial as well, especially considering a little more time can be accumulated slightly inverted while sleeping, and it may be beneficial to have your feet above your heart when resting supposedly. Inversion feels similar to scalp message to be honest.. Also to clarify I'm not inclined very dramatically, about a 5deg angle, maybe less. A thick enough pillow can just about even things out... http://www.featurepics.com/FI/Thumb300/20090112/Protractor-Ruler-Instrument-Degree-Circle-Angle-1034001.jpg

ubraj Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:21 am

Thanks Yanks.

I think the rest of my info gets lost in translation and maybe I didn't explain it properly so I'll say it brief

1. Females and Males have "vastly" different pathogen profiles due to iron, hormone, pregnancy, etc. and many pathogens are hormone sensitive and will use our hormones in a manner of speaking.

2. A lot of what's talked about that increases blood circulation also increase the lymphatic drainage.

3. Poor lymphatic system = poor oxygenation.

A quote

"Our blood carries oxygen and nutrients to capillaries where they are then passed onto the fluid around the cells which are called lymph. The body’s cells depend on the lymph system as the only way to drain off the large toxic materials and the excess fluid in our bodies which restricts the amount of oxygen our cells can get." http://www.livingpaleo.com/our-health-and-our-lymph-system/

hope this helps

SlowMoe Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:56 am

Ok. So is it just me or should stimulating blood flow/ lymphatic drainage be something that is incorporated into everyones routine? The reason I made this thread, is because it seems like a very important step and I generally do not see people advocating it on this site.

schpiloch123 Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:26 am

^agreed

ubraj Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:50 am

SlowMoe wrote:The reason I made this thread, is because it seems like a very important step and I generally do not see people advocating it on this site.

It gets brought up on this site.

CS mentions the use of Ecklonia Cava which is one of the best supplements for blood circulation. So much so if I'm not mistaken beats Viagra for ED, lol.

Have brought up Zeta Potential in the past which is preventing red blood cells from sticking together. While supplements have been posted in the past to help with zeta potential I no longer talk this way but more talk about reducing the pathogen burden to help with zeta potential instead.

Have also brought up electrical devices on this site such as originally LLLT and then later electrical/magnetic devices (aka Rife or PEMF) and briefly Violet Ray till others tried it for the increase circulation as well as CCSVI/biofilm/calcification.

Here is a quote on Zeta Potential that may give a better understanding from Dr. Loyd that has been posted before

hope this helps

"> I did live blood analysis for years with dark field and phase contrast

> microscopy. When the red blood cells stick together, the clumps get

> stuck in small blood vessels so the core heat of the body cannot get to

> the surface.

>

> The medical people call this a high sedimentation rate and it is a sign

> of inflammation.

>

> I tried lots of things to prevent blood from sludging. Sometimes

> enzymes would do it. Sometimes it was a hydration issue. If they drank

> a quart of water the blood would look great in 20 minutes.

>

> Treatment with the F-Scan would always broke up the stickiness. There

> are before and after pictures at

The user name is rifer

> and the password is fedfree. The F-Scan often found frequencies at 62000

> and 63000 that became known as the "sticky blood frequencies." You can
> divide those by 2 over and over until they will work on whatever

> equipment you might have.

>

> I think that infection is the most common issue."

"...I noticed years ago that reducing infections in the blood would reduce
the tendency for red blood cells to stick together..."

ubraj Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:25 pm

FWIW, another very good device for blood circulation but most especially to move the lymphatic system. One good unit is from earthpulse.net which has some good info at the site as well.

It's a PEMF like device which costs about $550.

However, can do the same thing but hooked up to the computer called ChiAmp to imitate the more expensive models. It costs about $100. I own this device.

Some info = http://www.frex.com.au/chiamp.html

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frex/message/12537

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frex/message/12512

Cheap source to buy = http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frex/message/12529

hope this helps

Zaphod Wed Jul 25, 2012 6:25 pm

Very interesting thread. I occasionally do inversions/headstands/handstands, and see my lymph is moving towards the scalp resulting relaxed galea and inreased blood flow. Using gravity from legs to scalp is imo important also for the other brain parts, including pineal, pitiuarly, thalamus, etc - areas of brain known for infections. When i started doing it my vividness of dream was positively effected as first thing i noticed. JDP's theory make a lot of sense to me. I think various physical methods works too as well as violet ray due same mechanism, but more localy to area of scalp and forehead.

I wonder about calcification, what are tips to prevent it/reverse it? Is mineral boost with K2 aka decalcify from IH all we need or there are techniques which work better/faster? Sorry, if it was written before...

And is cause for kidney stones also pathogenic and form of calcification?

ubraj Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:04 pm

I probably sound a bit off if someone reads a random post or two from me on this forum, lol. Smile

But hopefully if my prior posts are read as well then maybe a light bulb will go off and things start to come together.

As aging tree said on another forum, something like, am trying to teach someone how to fish rather than catching the fish for them.

The reason why is it's those who have accumulated enough knowledge and methods that work that are the ones who get the results. The one who is given a fish instead... well, they tend to come back needing another fish when the inevitable fork in the road appears.

Anyhow, yes, taking K2 MK4 or K2 MK7 is one of the best supplements or getting it in the diet such as fermented foods is a good way to help with calcification issues.

Another very big one being that in general, for most Western countries, avoidance of pasteurized milk being another big one as well IMO. Greatly caused by issues such as a large source of nanobacteria as well as other issues.. Here is a brief article. http://www.quintehealthsolutions.com/MilkNotGoodforYou.html

FWIW, nanobacteria being partly implicated in calcification issues as well as immune dysfunction and other issues but also greatly implicated in kidney stones.

This also means to avoid most calcium supplements due to the nanobacteria and other issues such as also needing enough magnesium to balance the calcium. However, most magnesium isn't good idea to take unless maybe magnesium malate or magnesium aspartate as in the long run it feeds l form bacteria which cause dysfunctional Vitamin D which further causes calcification issues and suppressed immune system.

There is more info to know but K2 and avoidance of pasteurized milk being two very big ones. For more info, can look into prior posts on this forum and also David Wolfe through a google search and youtube has good info on calcification as well which would include taking IP6 or ormus, etc..

Zaphod Wed Jul 25, 2012 7:46 pm

rdkml wrote:
This also means to avoid most calcium supplements due to the nanobacteria and other issues such as also needing enough magnesium to balance the calcium. However, most magnesium isn't good idea to take unless maybe magnesium malate or magnesium aspartate as in the long run it feeds l form bacteria which cause dysfunctional Vitamin D which further causes calcification issues and suppressed immune system.

News for my mother.

SlowMoe Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:41 pm

Rdkml, I was not aware ec was a circulation supplement.

I would also like to add that I feel that massaging the scalp and skull muscles in an effort to release scalp tension is vital to a hair growth routine. The study I posted earlier shows that hairloss can be reversed by simply removing tension to the galea. No
Vasodilators or anything.

IMO hair brushing is another method that should be incorporated into every regimen. Every time I get through brushing, my scalp feels super invigorated. From what I read this sort of scalp stimulation increases circulation for a day or more, and is something everyone can afford and only takes a few minutes a day. This also seems like it would be a key exercise in promoting angiogenesis on a large scale.

I also feel that blood thinning supplements such as ginkgo could contribute heavily to getting the blood into the restricted scalp blood vessels.

One other thing I believe strongly in is inversion. Zero, actually negative scalp tension, likely allows for an extremely high amount of blood/ lymphatic flow and toxin removal during the inversion period. My scalp feels great when I get finished.

IMO these things, at least brushing and massaging should be incorporated into every regimine. Anyone can afford them, And they only take a few minutes a day. Obviously keeping the scalp loose is enough, I notice that brushing frequently throughout te day does a good job of that.

Zaphod Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:42 pm

SlowMoe wrote:Rdkml, I was not aware ec was a circulation supplement.

I would also like to add that I feel that massaging the scalp and skull muscles in an effort to release scalp tension is vital to a hair growth routine. The study I posted earlier shows that hairloss can be reversed by simply removing tension to the galea. No
Vasodilators or anything.

If it works for you, doesnt mean it works for everybody. Everybody is unique and have different issues to solve to improve his health/hairloss. The origins of health - gut, teeth, stomach acid, HM detox, pathogens exposure, allergies,etc... are imo first and more important steps towards hairland to be first addressed. With other words i think we are debating strawberry on top of the cake. Still agree it might be usefull for everybody - at least in theory.

IMO hair brushing is another method that should be incorporated into every regimen. Every time I get through brushing, my scalp feels super invigorated. From what I read this sort of scalp stimulation increases circulation for a day or more, and is something everyone can afford and only takes a few minutes a day. This also seems like it would be a key exercise in promoting angiogenesis on a large scale.

as well as hot/cold therapy and head/hand stands/inversions/ maybe even inclined bed?

I also feel that blood thinning supplements such as ginkgo could contribute heavily to getting the blood into the restricted scalp blood vessels.

i think also vinpocetine works great - much cheaper source. Every vasodilator should be suplemented long termed to really see it's benefits.

One other thing I believe strongly in is inversion. Zero, actually negative scalp tension, likely allows for an extremely high amount of blood/ lymphatic flow and toxin removal during the inversion period. My scalp feels great when I get finished.

same here, my face is a bit swollen of lymph flow when doing it, but it's over in minutes - dont know what to think about this in long term.

IMO these things, at least brushing and massaging should be incorporated into every regimine. Anyone can afford them, And they only take a few minutes a day. Obviously keeping the scalp loose is enough, I notice that brushing frequently throughout te day does a good job of that.

Kind a same thoughts here.

SlowMoe Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:47 pm

Beebrox wrote:
SlowMoe wrote:Rdkml, I was not aware ec was a circulation supplement.

I would also like to add that I feel that massaging the scalp and skull muscles in an effort to release scalp tension is vital to a hair growth routine. The study I posted earlier shows that hairloss can be reversed by simply removing tension to the galea. No
Vasodilators or anything.

If it works for you, doesnt mean it works for everybody. Everybody is unique and have different issues to solve to improve his health/hairloss. The origins of health - gut, teeth, stomach acid, HM detox, pathogens exposure, allergies,etc... are imo first and more important steps towards hairland to be first addressed. With other words i think we are debating strawberry on top of the cake. Still agree it might be usefull for everybody - at least in theory.

When speaking of loosening the scalp to increase circulation and reverse hair loss, well yes, the study I posted proves that it works.... 18% increase in hair count in less than a year from loosening the scalp, nothing else

IMO hair brushing is another method that should be incorporated into every regimen. Every time I get through brushing, my scalp feels super invigorated. From what I read this sort of scalp stimulation increases circulation for a day or more, and is something everyone can afford and only takes a few minutes a day. This also seems like it would be a key exercise in promoting angiogenesis on a large scale.

as well as hot/cold therapy and head/hand stands/inversions/ maybe even inclined bed?

I also feel that blood thinning supplements such as ginkgo could contribute heavily to getting the blood into the restricted scalp blood vessels.

i think also vinpocetine works great - much cheaper source. Every vasodilator should be suplemented long termed to really see it's benefits.

One other thing I believe strongly in is inversion. Zero, actually negative scalp tension, likely allows for an extremely high amount of blood/ lymphatic flow and toxin removal during the inversion period. My scalp feels great when I get finished.

same here, my face is a bit swollen of lymph flow when doing it, but it's over in minutes - dont know what to think about this in long term.

IMO these things, at least brushing and massaging should be incorporated into every regimine. Anyone can afford them, And they only take a few minutes a day. Obviously keeping the scalp loose is enough, I notice that brushing frequently throughout te day does a good job of that.

Kind a same thoughts here.

SlowMoe Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:18 am

I should probably present a better basis for my remarks.

When I began my battle with hair loss four months ago, I shaved my head and immediately noticed that my scalp was very tight in the hairloss area (very easy to tell with short hair). So what I started to do was manually stretch the muscles in my scalp by gripping my head like a basketball, and pulling up. I also locally use my palm to push up on my temporal skin, and also forehead and back of head, and hold for a bit.

After a little while, I notice the tension go away. I also notice the tension returning; when stress hits. It's a very distinct sensation when you go from a loose state to tight under stress.

All I do when this happens, is reach up and loosen my scalp, sometimes I have to hold it for a few seconds, but my scalp loosens, and my stress actually goes away for the most part!

I have said from the beginning that I believe loosening the scalp is the key to returning bloodflow, so has MALINIAK. Now we have proof.

One thing I rarely hear advocated on this site; make sure your scalp stays loose.

I notice that massaging the scalp muscles, and brushing (not vigorously) has the same effect most of the time. But I frequently check the tension up there with the basketball grip. My favorite stretch Is to grab the back o my head, about four inches apart just where my nw7 hairline would be, and squeeze the skin together and pull the entire assembly forward, I think this does the most to really stretch the scalp muscles and keep it loose up there.

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