How paleolithic is the IH diet?

How paleolithic is the IH diet? how is the IH diet different from a paleolithic diet?

ezmbh wrote:How paleolithic is the IH diet? how is the IH diet different from a paleolithic diet?

The difference between the two is the PD (paleolithic diet) is a much less calorie/mostly raw-food diet, consisting of gathering and grazing all day, mostly raw fruit, vegetables, and nuts/seeds, more than likely some raw-eggs when they could find some or some raw fish (back when they were clean) if needed. It contains no dairy like milk or cheese or cooking-oils like coconut-oil or ground-beef (unlike IH-diet).

Also I'm sure exercise plays a role, they obviously moved-around more because they didn't have cars, buses, trains or plains and were probably always cautious of predators, having to run-away or try and fight 'em off. The cavemen following the PD probably also had to fast for days without food, surviving on their body-fat for calories.

ezmbh - I advocate metabolic typing and/or assessing oxidation rate (fast, medium or slow).

In my particular case, no grains (cereals), no pasteurized milk, no sugar or refined starches, processed oils or processed fats.

CausticSymmetry wrote:, processed oils or processed fats.

CS wouldn't you agree that all cooking-oils including palm and coconut are processed foods, considering that they aren't found in nature? I doubt (thou I might be wrong) that cavemen stumbled across a jar of coconut-oil.

Coconut oil and palm oil is not processed food.

Meat does not contain trans fat in the sense your leading people to believe.

If you speak in absolutes you'll win but without seeing the bigger picture.

If you go to the frozen meat section, you'll find trans fat is added. But it's not added in the sense of adding plastics to cookies for better taste. With that said, sulfites and even viruses are added but for another discussion. Freeze the meat or vacuum pack and you'll also increase amines.

jdp701 wrote:Coconut oil and palm oil is not processed food.

Have you ever come across a jar of coconut-oil or palm-oil found naturally in nature?

jdp701 wrote:

Meat does not contain trans fat in the sense your leading people to believe.

Red-meat and dairy does naturally have trans-fat in it. Not as much as Oreo-cookies or ice-cream, but it does still have some.

misterE,

Again, if you speak in absolutes you'll win.

So again, there is a difference between the petroleum based plastic that's added to cookies and processed foods and the trace amounts that are found in meat. Again, the trace amounts of trans fat found in meat is not the same as what's added to cookies and processed foods to bring out the flavor.

It's just like talking about the trans fat content of beans. Should we avoid beans because they have small amounts of trans fat. No, because it's different then what's purposely added to cookies and processed foods to bring out the flavor.

Regarding coconut oil and palm oil... do you even realize how coconut oil is made? What occurs is you grab a coconut and filter it so to speak. That's all.

So by your definition that coconut oil is processed food, then taking a carrot and some fruit and putting it in a juicer = processed food.

You're full of absolutes without seeing the bigger picture. It's just as you said sometime back that you followed the IH diet and it didn't work for you. Then you went vegan and it worked. That's great and all but CS has never recommended a specific diet for everyone. Has always said everyone is different.

it's funny because doing the diet mistere proposes is the most unnatural diet ever known to man (except for current SAD diet)

ie: no vegetarian cultures every on the planet or raw fooders...

mister do you know most of the vegetation in most parts of the world are inedible and if they are there calories are useless for sustaining life and energy for humans which is why there are no vegetarian societies,, vegetarian is only remotely practical because of our advanced agriculture and ability to create new vegetables, which most of the food you eat was created in the last 5000-8000 years for example eating broccoli.

where is my diet is almost all primal and been around since beginning of time, eggs, raw milk, wild game, etc.

yeah if you leave coconut milk sit the oil seperates going to the top in a layer. CS would you consider 100% maple syrup unhealthy,or would you definitely avoid it and how about molasses?

jdp701 wrote:



So again, there is a difference between the petroleum based plastic that's added to cookies and processed foods and the trace amounts that are found in meat. Again, the trace amounts of trans fat found in meat is not the same as what's added to cookies and processed foods to bring out the flavor.

I agree. The trans-fat found in processed-chunk-food is defiantly worse.

jdp701 wrote:

It's just like talking about the trans fat content of beans. Should we avoid beans because they have small amounts of trans fat.

I don't think trans-fat is found in beans, only in processed-foods and small amounts in red-meat and dairy. Beans are very low in fat (5-8%) and high in fiber, especially soluble-fiber, which would bind any fat found in the beans and prevent its absorption and promotes its excretion.

Balthier wrote:yeah if you leave coconut milk sit the oil seperates going to the top in a layer. CS would you consider 100% maple syrup unhealthy,or would you definitely avoid it and how about molasses?

Fat is worse than sugar. Contrary to popular belief, refined-sugars actually make the body’s insulin work more efficiently [1]!

Studies comparing sugar intake with risk of developing type-2-diabetes show that people on high-sugar-diets are less likely to get diabetes [2]. There is, however a strong relationship between red meat consumption and diabetes [3].

[1] Carbohydrates, fat, and insulin action.
[2] A prospective study of sugar intake and risk of type 2 diabetes in women.
[3] A prospective study of red meat consumption and type 2 diabetes in middle-aged and elderly women.

oh misteree when will you learn....

Processed meat, not red meat per se, linked to CHD, diabetes

Boston, MA - The first study to systematically separate out the effects of red unprocessed meat from processed-meat products has shown that eating the former is not associated with an increased risk of coronary heart disease or diabetes [1].

But eating 50 g of processed meat per day—the equivalent of one typical hot dog in the US, or two slices of deli meat—was associated with a 42% higher risk of CHD and a 19% increased risk of diabetes, say Dr Renata Micha (Harvard School of Public Health, Boston, MA) and colleagues in their paper published online May 17, 2010 in Circulation.

http://www.theheart.org/article/1079649.do

Mistere what do you think about that? Red meat is not the blame which CS knew for a long time now

blackjack wrote:Mistere what do you think about that?

blackjack, please post the actual study instead of an article. I can literally pull up hundreds of articles showing red-meat causes heart disease... all I would have to do, is google the term "red meat heart disease"! But doing that is counter-productive, I will not respond to any other than a study.

misterE wrote: I will not respond to any other than a study.

Then, respond to this: click, click
And if you have time: this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this and this

All I was pointing is that you can make your own coconut oil naturally. If fat is so bad coconuts and avocados must be horrible for you then according to your theories then right?

misterE wrote:

Balthier wrote:yeah if you leave coconut milk sit the oil seperates going to the top in a layer. CS would you consider 100% maple syrup unhealthy,or would you definitely avoid it and how about molasses?

Fat is worse than sugar. Contrary to popular belief, refined-sugars actually make the body’s insulin work more efficiently [1]!

Studies comparing sugar intake with risk of developing type-2-diabetes show that people on high-sugar-diets are less likely to get diabetes [2]. There is, however a strong relationship between red meat consumption and diabetes [3].

[1] Carbohydrates, fat, and insulin action.
[2] A prospective study of sugar intake and risk of type 2 diabetes in women.
[3] A prospective study of red meat consumption and type 2 diabetes in middle-aged and elderly women.

Plant-fat is not as bad as animal-fat. Animal-fat is nothing more than aromatase-enzymes and it contains cholesterol and no phytonutrients. When you heat animal-fat, the fat and cholesterol oxidizes and creates carcinogens and free-radicals. Plant-fat contains phytosterols like beta-sitosterol and thousands of phytonutrients, plus plant-fats are usually not heated or grilled, instead eaten raw.

so coconut oil is perfectly fine with you then?

Balthier wrote:so coconut oil is perfectly fine with you then?

Plant-fats should also be limited in my opinion. Coconut-oil is ok if you're eating a coconut, but I don't think it is healthy to use the extracted-oil. Cooking oil, rather it be from olive, coconut, palm, canola, grapeseed, soybean or whatever, is the most concentrated source of calories on the planet, clocking in at 120 calories (from fat) per tablespoon!

Not to mention the fat found in cooking-oils (and animal-products) is already in the form of triglycerides and when eaten, turns directly into body-fat, which creates estrogen and decreases insulin-sensitivity.

This is utter garbage. This forum is becoming polluted!

Anyone who does any modicum of research on coconut will find that the above statement is false.

CausticSymmetry wrote:

Anyone who does any modicum of research on coconut will find that the above statement is false.

Are you claiming that triglycerides aren't the main constituent in cooking-oil or animal-fats?

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/71/2/412?ijkey=34cf92dd47dd2ac896d0e975e1f108ef31aa5b16

Carbohydrate-induced hypertriacylglycerolemia: historical perspective and review of biological mechanisms1,2,3
Elizabeth J Parks and Marc K Hellerstein

1 From the Department of Food Science and Nutrition, University of Minnesota–Twin Cities, St Paul, and the Department of Nutritional Sciences, University of California, Berkeley.

2 Supported by funds from the International Life Sciences Institute North America.

3 Address reprint requests to EJ Parks, Department of Food Science and Nutrition, University of Minnesota–Twin Cities, St Paul, MN 55108-6099. E-mail: eparks@tc.umn.edu.

this is an excellent review of carbohydrate-induced high triglycerides