Goitrogenic effect of cruciferous vegetables

I eat a lot of raw cruciferous vegetables. I've recently learned that cruciferous vegetables can have a goitrogenic effect.

I was wondering: can the goitrogenic effect of consuming cruciferous vegetables be counteracted by taking lugol's solution?

thanks,
MP

PS:
Wikipedia defines goitrogens as "substances which suppress the thyroid gland by interfering with the uptake of iodine." Is interfering with iodine uptake the only way a substance can have a goitrogenic effect? If so, then I would think that supplementing with lugol's solution would counteract the goitrogenic effects of consuming raw cruciferous vegetables.

I'm interested in hearing a response to this as well.

This topic has been covered perhaps dozens of times on this forum. In short, studies show that the only animals who were deficient in iodine had a problem when they consumed a very high quantity of these vegetables. As information on this topic spread, many authors left out the important detail that the animals who had a thyroid problem only occurred when animals were iodine deficient.

Also, sufficient iodine will prevent this in say the hypothetical situation of consuming nothing but these vegetables in ones diet.

Sorry CS. I'll remember to use the search function next time.

mphatesmpb - No problem, the search function on here really doesn't work as well as it should, kind of hit or miss.

I think the main problem is that the search function looks only at the titles of threads rather than the actual content.

CS - The flashlight and eye test says I have an adrenal problem. I may also have a thyroid problem but I am not sure.

Diets such as the anti estrogenic diet promote eating a lot of cruciferous vegetables and some mebers of this forum say there adrenals have improved due to sorting out their diet and eating similar to this. I have some iodine but as far as I'm aware, my adrenals have to recover before supporting the thyroid. If I eat lots of cruciferous vegetables to help heal my adrenals, am I damaging my thyroid?

tooyoung wrote:CS - The flashlight and eye test says I have an adrenal problem. I may also have a thyroid problem but I am not sure.

Diets such as the anti estrogenic diet promote eating a lot of cruciferous vegetables and some mebers of this forum say there adrenals have improved due to sorting out their diet and eating similar to this. I have some iodine but as far as I'm aware, my adrenals have to recover before supporting the thyroid. If I eat lots of cruciferous vegetables to help heal my adrenals, am I damaging my thyroid?

What are the flashlight and eye tests?

scotty - Look in a mirror in a dark room with a flashlight pointing across your eye. If your pupil keeps shuddering and not being able to stay at one point, this suggests you have adrenal problems.

Diets such as the anti estrogenic diet promote eating a lot of cruciferous vegetables and some members of this forum say there adrenals have improved due to sorting out their diet and eating similar to this. I have some iodine but as far as I'm aware, my adrenals have to recover before supporting the thyroid. If I eat lots of cruciferous vegetables to help heal my adrenals, am I damaging my thyroid?

Should I supplement a low amount of iodine and make my diet better with more vegetables while trying to heal my adrenals, then once they are better up the dose a bit of iodine?

tooyoung - The information that created a stir over cruciferous vegetables was performed on animals who were known to be deficient in iodine and ate only these vegetables with this experiment.

But there's nothing wrong with trying some iodine. The eye test is just one of many tests, by itself it doesn't not mean you have low adrenal function.

Does eating crucifers raw or cooked affect anything regarding the thyroid? Is raw or cooked best in general?

tooyoung,

Many of the health benefits of consuming cruciferous vegetables are brought about by a class of compounds called glucosinolates. Boiling and steaming causes a significant reduction in the glucosinolate-content of cruciferous vegetables. As far as I know, there are two major disadvantages to eating them raw: (1) the potential for thyroid suppression, and (2) the gas. Cooking solves both of these problems (goitrogens are deactivated by cooking). But as mentioned, you'd be losing a lot of the important nutrients that are helpful in fighting hair loss:

Here's an excerpt from the Linus Pauling article on cruciferous vegetables:

Does cooking alter the cancer-protective effects of cruciferous vegetables?

Glucosinolates are water-soluble compounds that may be leached into cooking water. Boiling cruciferous vegetables for 9-15 minutes results in 20-60% decreases in the total glucosinolate content of cruciferous vegetables. Cooking methods that use less water, such as steaming or microwaving, may reduce glucosinolate losses. However, some cooking practices, including boiling, steaming, and microwaving at high power (850-900 watts) may inactivate myrosinase, the enzyme responsible for the breakdown of glucosinolates into isothiocyanates and indoles. Although human intestinal bacteria can break down glucosinolates to some degree, several studies in humans have found that heat inactivation of myrosinase in cruciferous vegetables substantially decreases the bioavailability of isothiocyanates. To maximize the bioavailability of isothiocyanates and indoles, it's probably best to eat cruciferous vegetables raw or microwaved at low power.

You'd also be getting more sulforaphane (I believe that sulforaphane is a metabolite of a certain glucosinate) from raw cruciferous vegetables. Check out the following threads.

https://immortalhair.forumotion.com/t4565-sulforaphane?highlight=sulforaphane
https://immortalhair.forumotion.com/t1255-sulforaphane-activates-the-transcription-factor-nrf2-and-induces-phase-2-and-antioxidant-enzymes-in-human-keratinocytes?highlight=sulforaphane

I personally eat a lot of raw cruciferous vegetables (I just had a plate full of raw broccoli, with some blueberries and almonds on the side. It was great). Cruciferous vegetables can potentially suppress thyroid function by inhibiting the uptake of iodine - and this problem can hopefully be solved by getting more iodine through either diet or supplementation.

How much iodine per day would you suggest would be enough to eat raw cruciferous veggies without problems?

I ate a lo of kale every night for many months, like he whole bunch or close to i, ae 150 mcg iodine, and the Doctor tested my thyroid and said it was still in normal limis but cauitioned me that i was close to being over the line.

Steve

stevelord wrote:

I ate a lo of kale every night for many months, like he whole bunch or close to i, ae 150 mcg iodine, and the Doctor tested my thyroid and said it was still in normal limis but cauitioned me that i was close to being over the line.

Steve

I am trying to find a listing of how much goitrogen is in each type of cruciferous. I think I did this once before and I think cabbage had more, not sure. I'll see

Steve

KI is short for potassium iodide, Steve

Horm Metab Res 1995 Oct;27(10):450-4

Iodine metabolism in response to goitrogen induced altered thyroid status under conditions of moderate and high intake of iodine.

Lakshmy R, Rao PS, Sesikeran B, Suryaprakash P.

National Institute of Nutrition, Indian Council of Medical Research, Hyderabad, India.

Metabolic experiments in rats were undertaken to relate excretory pattern of iodine and thiocyanate, with thyroid weight and the circulating levels of thyroxine, in response to moderate and high intake of iodine and under conditions of goitrogen induced altered thyroid status. On a moderate intake of iodine (by depriving diet of KI) 25 mg of thiocyanate or substitution of 1/3rd proportion of casein based diet with dry cabbage, could significantly reduce plasma thyroxine level by 60 days. Neither body weight nor the weights of liver, kidney, heart or spleen were affected due to exposure to goitrogens. A significant increase in thyroid weight as well as higher excretion of iodine and thiocyanate were evident in goitrogen-fed rats. Presence of high amounts of KI, to a certain extent, offered protection from adverse effects of the goitrogens. Semi quantitative assessment of thyroid, indicated hypofunctioning of thyroid with follicular hyperplasia in thiocyanate fed rats. These alterations were of moderate degree in response to cabbage feeding. These results emphasize that, moderate intake of iodine, adequate to meet iodine requirement, may not ensure normal functioning of thyroid in the presence of goitrogens.

stevelord wrote:

I ate a lot of kale every night for many months, like he whole bunch or close to i, ae 150 mcg iodine, and the Doctor tested my thyroid and said it was still in normal limis but cauitioned me that i was close to being over the line.

Steve

Correction, I doubt if I ate the entire bunch every nite but I ate a lot every night



Steve

stevelord - My suggestion to you is not to eat cruciferous raw too often, on occasion is fine, but if you're looking to consume a lot of cruciferous vegetables, either steam them, or as teacup has suggested, fermented them.

Depending on how much you ate, i would say 1000mcg would cover you well and truly.

Silverlin wrote:stevelord - My suggestion to you is not to eat cruciferous raw too often, on occasion is fine, but if you're looking to consume a lot of cruciferous vegetables, either steam them, or as teacup has suggested, fermented them.

Depending on how much you ate, i would say 1000mcg would cover you well and truly.

Yeah, I agree, thakale I spoke of was always steamed. Thanks.

Seve