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Post  Amaranthaceae Sun Nov 30, 2008 2:11 am

http://www.lclabs.com/PRODFILE/D-F/E-5880.php4

100 mg [4',7-Isoflavandiol] for 78 USD, not too bad!

Could be a viable alternative to HMR, PM etc.

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Post  CausticSymmetry Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:54 pm

cpio - That price has come down quite a bit since its inception, but you will see at the bottom that it is still not for human consumption yet. As before they also state that in the future they will provide a product at attractive prices for human consumption. This was first stated back in 2004, and here we are still waiting for it.
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Post  Amaranthaceae Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:04 am

IH, there are some very intriguing studies on Equol, in particular that it binds selectively and with higher
affinity to DHT than any other "phytostrogen" compounds.

If you are not alresdy familiar with this study check it out!

Equol Is a Novel Anti-Androgen that Inhibits Prostate Growth and Hormone Feedback

Trent D. Lund2,3, Daniel J. Munson3, Megan E. Haldy3, Kenneth D.R. Setchell4, Edwin D. Lephart5, and Robert J. Handa3

Equol (7-hydroxy-3[4'hydroxyphenyl]-chroman) is the major metabolite of the phytoestrogen daidzein, one of the main isoflavones found abundantly in soybeans and soy foods. Equol may be an important biologically active molecule based on recent studies demonstrating that equol can modulate reproductive function. In this study, we examined the effects of equol on prostate growth and LH secretion and determined some of the mechanisms by which it might act. Administration of equol to intact male rats for 4–7 days reduced ventral prostate and epididymal weight and increased circulating LH levels. Using binding assays, we determined that equol specifically binds 5{alpha}-dihydrotestosterone (DHT), but not testosterone, dehydroepiandrosterone, or estrogen with high affinity. Equol does not bind the prostatic androgen receptor, and has a modest affinity for recombinant estrogen receptor (ER) ß, and no affinity for ER{alpha}. In castrated male rats treated with DHT, concomitant treatment with equol blocked DHT's trophic effects on the ventral prostate gland growth and inhibitory feedback effects on plasma LH levels without changes in circulating DHT. Therefore, equol can bind circulating DHT and sequester it from the androgen receptor, thus altering growth and physiological hormone responses that are regulated by androgens. These data suggest a novel model to explain equol's biological properties. The significance of equol's ability to specifically bind and sequester DHT from the androgen receptor have important ramifications in health and disease and may indicate a broad and important usage for equol in the treatment of androgen-mediated pathologies. (http://www.biolreprod.org/cgi/content/full/70/4/1188)

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Post  Amaranthaceae Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:07 am

.. Could be that conflicting observations re Soy would make better sense when taking into account a distinction between equol and non-equolproducing participants.

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Post  CausticSymmetry Mon Dec 01, 2008 9:31 am

cpio - Yes I think so too. Back in 2004, I was to put it mildly, obsessed with figuring out how to make the stuff on our own. There have been strains of bacteria/flora that have been identified, but I'm not sure if anyone has figured out how to safely convert a non-producer into a producer.

There are some dietary factors, but nothing that makes a non-producer an absolute producer. Hopefully this will be discovered, because equol is somewhat of a holy grail to stopping hair loss.
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Post  Amaranthaceae Mon Dec 01, 2008 7:07 pm

A holy grail? Now you are getting me obsessed! It does look good on paper but to what extent it would work in regard to hair loss only an actual experiment will let us know more.

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Post  Amaranthaceae Mon Dec 01, 2008 8:31 pm

IH did you take a Soy complex to find out if you possibly were an equolproducer?

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Post  CausticSymmetry Tue Dec 02, 2008 5:46 am

cpio - Soy isoflavones are tricky, because even if one is not an equol producer, taking large amounts of Genistein and Daidzein (the isoflavone that is primarily responsible for conversion into equol) can still product results. I had not taken soy isoflavones for any great length of time, as I was never that impressed with the research. I should mention that Kudzu contains both these isoflavones usually at about 2% of their dry weight.
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Post  Amaranthaceae Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:18 am

I found a bottle of Planetary herbals kudzu lobata in my cubboard that I started today and will take for a month. It has 500 mg root and 200 mg extract standardized to 40% isoflavones per. tablet. (http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails.aspx?c=1&pid=4597&at=0)

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Post  Gromit137 Mon Oct 26, 2009 9:04 am

Anyone ever try mixing up an Equol topical and using it? Would it work?

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