The prostate, and it's possible role in hair loss

Am I right in saying that the prostate enlarges when exposed to estrogen? Am I right in saying that this is why older men bald, because their prostate then releases a whole bunch of DHT, triggered by the high estrogen, which attacks the follicles?

So......

What about if someone raised their estrogen by mistake? So let's say me, when I pushed my SHBG levels low, or someone who eats a lot of a food or drinks a lot of a drink that raises estrogen.

The prostate might grow... right?

So... does it naturally return to normal size?

If it STAYED at that size and did not get smaller again... that would potentially affect hair loss, would it not? As it would CONTINUE to give out DHT.

What do we think about this? Is it true?


I am constantly trying to find rational explanations for this silly thing people refer to as "activating the male pattern baldness gene" on some forums. I just don't think it's true that you just set the gene off and then there is no turning back. I think something CREATES this illusion. Be that raised insulin resistance, hypothyroidism, or perhaps even a larger prostate?

What do we think?


Hoppi

I am the DPDR of HLT

We also believe that estrogen may be one of the culprits in prostate cancer, but also the high levels of DHT

Hoppipolla - In young people with MPB, SHBG tends to be on the low side. However, in older men, SHBG tends to get too high, allowing estrogen to become a dominant force.

Benign Prostatic hyperplasia (enlarged prostate) is generally estrogen fueled. Believe it or not, large amounts of DHT can actually shrink the prostate. Of course DHT blockers also help to shrink the prostate, because they generally increase testosterone, lower estrogen and DHT.

The best way to prevent prostate cancer in my opinion is to have adequate iodine saturation in body tissue. Most men or women will not achieve this. The thyroid needs to fulfill its capacity first in order the the remaining body tissue to utilize it, including the prostate.

Iodine halts estrogen's effects on proliferation of cells, therefore preventing hyperplasia. In all cancers, there a thyroid problem.

Secondary measures to protect the prostate are selenium, vitamin D and magnesium sufficiency.

It's not a good idea to inhibit DHT too much, which is the aim of pharmaceutical companies who have successfully convinced most medical professionals that DHT is evil.

For example, in an article written by Jonathan Wright, explored a potentially new measure for prostate cancer risk which has to do with DHT/Androstanediol ratios.

DHT isn't so bad if you have enough Androstanediol. DHT promotes cellular disruption, but Androstanediol promotes normalization. If you inhibit DHT too strongly, you will not have enough androstanediol.

Jonathan Wright suggested that ratios of DHT/Androstanediol be 1 or higher. What is interesting is that he has found many men using Propecia who have levels much less than 1 and even some using Saw Palmetto with less than favorable numbers.

There was a media heralded study in the NEJM (link below) on the "benefits" of Finasteride using in prostate cancer prevention.

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/NEJMoa030660v1

Wright paraphrased the researchers in the Journal who wrote, "that neglecting the DHT/Androstanediol ratio was a major factor in the outcome of the recent Prostate Cancer Prevention Trial. (This is not shown in the abstract).

The trial determined that cancer risk in the Finasteride group was 24.8 percent less. However, 37 percent of the cases in the finasteride group were highly aggressive compared to 22.2% highly aggressive in the group not using finasteride.

So the bottom line was perhaps the DHT/Androstanediol ratio. So while curtailing DHT can be good for some, it can also have potentially deadly consequences for others, since it can reduce protective Androstanediol and change a slow growing cancer into an aggressive form.

Note also, that excessive flaxseed oil consumption has been found to be associated with increased risk of prostate cancer. The probable reason? DHT is inhibited too much and there is a loss of co-factor vitamins needed for the conversion of alpha linoleic acid to EPA and DHA (magnesium, zinc and B6).

As far as whether there is an increased incidence of balding with BPH and prostate cancer, no correlations have been found to be statistically significant. Most likely, because these conditions happen to older men, who in large part by then will suffer from some sort of thyroid problem and impaired glucose metabolism.

Ah so CS you think those are probably the reasons?

I was arguing with some guys about this because it seems to me that when guys get old they lose hair FAST. Yet it makes no sense according to most of their arguments that follicles just "get more sensitive to androgens". Then they go on to say that T levels AND DHT levels go down!! So like... what on earth are the follicles reacting to? lol

So, do you think CS that the DHT does often go up? But where does it come from if not the prostate?

And testosterone levels are low... but are there other factors such as inflammation affecting the follicles?

Thanks, I was just curious!

Hoppi!

Hoppipolla - The problem is mitochondrial decay. DHT is merely a signaling molecule. Increased senescence is why older men lose more hair. They also increase their estrogen and insulin resistance, which is a result of mitochondrial decay.

Oh so, what should they take for it? Sorry, excuse my ignorance and forgetfulness, there is just so much to learn, but believe me this approach to MPB makes so much more sense to me and I am quite enjoying learning more about my body and how best to take care of my hair ^_^


Oh and as a footnote, does my current regimen get your approval (apologies for the Fin and things, I guess I'm just playing it safe, but it's an ultra-low dose just to take the edge off my DHT!)? !

Hoppipolla - The answer to mitochondrial decay is to reverse all the factors contributing to it. What are these? Typically accumulation of metals. Some metals cause thyroid dysfunction, others "breakdown" hormones, however hormone depletion in of itself is not only a hallmark of aging, it causes aging and impairs blood sugar metabolism.

My personal favorite way to circumvent insulin problems and metal accumulations is lipoic acid. It raises antioxidant enzyme systems, and prevents toxic metal oxidation. Of course, there's more to this than lipoic acid. It is further complimented by magnesium, iodine, selenium, ecklonia cava, vitamin C, vitamin D and acetyl L-carnitine.

Ah cool. It's really cool I think understanding it in this much detail because otherwise for so many people when "Take Fin, take Fin, take Fin" (as most people say) is not a viable option, they are left completely out in the cold.

It's great that you give people an option which is good for their health and completely separate to the Fin option!

Oh, speaking of the regimen, could I ask 2 small things about it? First of all how much it can be cut down if the person goes on a strict good diet, takes care of their liver and checks their thyroid? And second, if maybe slightly cheaper alternatives to those in the top 6 could be given? I am actually trying to earn more money at the mo so I will probably be ok, but when I first saw the site and was learning, I was wary of how how little money I had when I was looking at the iherb supplements! I think it would benefit many people to have more "budget" options as well

Hoppipolla - It's hard to say. Jdp710 has done a lot of research on diet and ultimately, he discovered how to stop his hair loss once eliminating all of the inflammation producing foods.

As mentioned above, it's difficult to say, b/c there are varying degrees of aggressiveness on hair loss, probably due to numerous factors. Contained in these hundreds of pages on this forum are good examples of what can go wrong with environmental toxin exposure.

As long as you're eliminating more toxins than you're you in taking-in, the body should be fine. It takes years to build up these toxins of course, and they are continually being re-released into the blood stream via bone turnover. Next is the food. Because we are all different, it can take time to figure out what foods are trouble prone.

Taken together, the degree of supplements you need maybe proportional to the the degree of inflammation you have.

At some point, you may find yourself knowing your body (how it reacts to various kinds of foods), well enough to answer these questions.

wow that's really interesting thank you

I had no idea that inflammation was that huge a part of MPB! I was just thinking DHT, DHT, DHT... and never thought to look at other factors this much!

I am suddenly much more confident about the abilities of curcumin and resveratrol to help me!

I think I will also make a little list of all the things that effect MPB, as I discover and learn about them, so I can ensure I am tackling them!

And so, is there any way to gauge how these things are hitting my body? For example just now I had a chicken korma, no bread (as I'm avoiding gluten). Is that prooobably ok? I mean of course I'm from Italy mostly so... will my body not like it? I wish I could find out with slightly better clarity!

Thank you very much anyway, I feel like I am better understanding myself